Sid Roth

Sid:  Now my guest, I’ve been looking forward to interviewing for a while, his name is Rob DeLuca. He is from New Zealand, Senior Pastor of His Way Church in Auckland, New Zealand.  And the reason I’ve been looking forward to interviewing him is that I have a pet question that I ask people that are being used mightily by God.  I’m very disappointed in a number of the prophets because I look in the old covenant and I see people wouldn’t say thus sayeth the Lord unless it really was God because they’d end up being stoned and today prophecy is cheap, the words fall to the ground.  So I said, “Who do you know, who’s the top prophet you know?”  Well, he a prophet from New Zealand, his name is Rob DeLuca and that’s why, well I made it a point of meeting Rob and inviting him to be a guest.  Now Rob could you tell me the circumstances of the prophecy of the Lakeland, Revival?

Rob:  I had a vision from the Lord and I saw four nations being touched.  The vision was of a boomerang and…

Sid:  So you get the boomerang in Australia, now that fits.

Rob:  That’s right and I saw it touch the nation of England, Australia, New Zealand and America.  So I saw this boomerang and I saw it come to America, but it had a little bit more accuracy to it and it flew straight into Florida.  And I saw it hit the city of Lakeland. The Holy Spirit said, “What took place with Pensacola and the Pensacola revival; what took place with Rodney Howard Brown in the awakening in the ‘90s is about to take place.”  And the Lord showed me that it was going to go from thousands to tens of thousands, to hundreds of thousands.  And I saw a nail spike over the state of Florida, and I saw the Hand of God come out of the heavens and hit the spike into the ground of Florida.  And as I saw that I saw a scroll out from the spike and there was one sentence on the scroll and it said “The Kingdom of God has now come.”  I saw news media, I saw journalists, I saw television broadcasts in the news witnessing this revival, witnessing the miracles and I saw journalists dumbfounded awestruck by the presence of God and the testimony of the miracles that were taking place.  It was pretty intense and it was accurate because 3 ½ weeks later it started to take place.

Sid:  Rob let me take you back a bit, at 11 you were saved and unfortunately as is happening to many young people they get saved and even in Christian homes you drifted into the culture of the day.  And at 18 you hit bottom, explain.

Rob:  Well, when I was 11 I accepted Jesus Christ in my heart, I was filled with the Holy Spirit, but I had no root in the word of God.  And we were just coming out of Catholicism and the charismatic movement was taking place in the 70’s. I even had prophet’s prophecy over me when I was young that God was going to use me to be a preacher and that I was going to minister to the masses.  But as time went by in my teenage years I started doing drugs and I got mixed up with a wrong crowd by the time I was 18 I ended up homeless in a cardboard box.

Sid:  You know you read about things like that, you don’t think it happens, that was probably the last thing in the world you thought would ever happen to you.

Rob:  I never ever imaged that that would take place.  I lived in a cardboard box in an ally in the streets of Los Angeles.

Sid:  But there was an occasion where a woman walked up to you and started talking to you and sharing the gospel, tell me about that.

Rob:  There was a woman named Barbara Martin. My friend and I were standing on a street corner, we were waiting to get some drugs and she walked up to us and she started sharing about the love of Jesus Christ. She told me how I was feeling in my heart and that I had sin in my heart and I knew that because of my experience when I was a young boy.  And she asked me “Did I want to give my heart totally over to Jesus?”  And as she prayed for me she asked me to say the sinner’s prayer and ask Jesus to come into my heart once again afresh and I did.  And then she laid her hands on my head and the presence of God came all over me and I started almost to fall back and I knew that day that I totally surrendered to the Lord.

Sid:  You know one of the things I see a lot of the people that are touched by God are then going out on the street and doing the same things that caused you to become a believer.  I have to believe that it’s hard for someone to walk away from having an experiential thing happen to them, verses something they can’t say I remember when the power of God came on me.

Rob:  Well, our God is a God of experience, our God is a God that you can feel, or God is a God that can touch us.  And that’s what took place, it was more than just a prayer it was the Lord touching me by the power of the Holy Spirit and that’s what caused me to really want more of Him, more of that experience in His presence.

Sid:  You know I’m reminded of the scripture says, “This is eternal life, that you might know Him.”  But somehow the gospel in America anyway is that you might believe in Him, not know Him.  There’s a lot of people I believe in, but I don’t know them; the whole objective is to know Jesus.

Rob:  Well, if we know Jesus then we’re going to know the Jesus of the gospels. When Jesus walked into a town or when He walked into a home He carried supernatural power.  And people experienced the witness of that supernatural power all around them whether it was a person being healed or a person being forgiven of their sins and weeping and crying and being cleansed; or if it was just watching that type of encounter with the Lord they saw something that was supernatural.

Sid:  You know Rob when I first met you, and I decided I was going to interview you, I said “What teaching do you have that’s important to get into the hands of those that are listening as a tool to mentor them?”  And you told me a couple teachings, but the one you really wanted people to get is the one on “Breaking the Power of Covetousness” which has to do with prosperity.  And I have to tell you it turned me off, why because I have seen such an unbalance in what is called the gospel of property where it’s really based on wrong motives and wrong desires and so I actually backed off, not completely because I’m a giver, but I’ve backed off because I’ve seen the excess.  And after listening to your message I was actually backing off more than I should have in over reaction to what I see on television.  What did God tell you about this particular message, “Breaking the Power of Covetousness?”

Rob:  Well, when God gave me this message I felt like it was a word for the entire world, the Lord showed me that this message would go throughout the nations and it would set people free from wrong motives in the prosperity message.  You see I really believe that God wants to bless us. The Bible says that He is the God of blessing but our desires must be pure concerning blessing, concerning prosperity.  The Holy Spirit showed me that many people have made prosperity, or the prosperity message to be all, end all and they think that is the great harvest, or that is the end of what we call Christianity, but it isn’t.  It’s a means to the end; you see, God will bless us for a reason, but the means to the end or the end of the result of being blessed is to be a blessing to the world, to see souls saved, and to see the kingdom of God you know established throughout the nation.

Sid:  Now God wants us to prosper. What does prosperity mean to you?

Rob:  Prosperity to me personally is being able to have all your needs met, and also have more than enough to be able to be a blessing to others.  Now the definition of prosperity verses say a person that’s going to work and has a wife and kids and they’re saying “You know what?”  We have our house, God’s blessed us and you know what we want to be a blessing to the mission field.  I can see that as prosperity, but then there’s others you know you can be a businessman and say you know what I’m believing for millions of dollars so I can build churches and take care of orphans and do all the work of kingdom and take care of widows and what have you.  You know that’s prosperity too so really it’s defined depending upon where you’re at in your life.

Sid:  You know what I think is amazing that as wrapped up as you are in revival which is really seven days a week, 24-7 you still are a businessman.  How in the world do you juggle both?

Rob:  By the grace of God. You know in New Zealand I owned three restaurants and also I have two coffee houses and a coffee roasting business, and that has enabled me to be a volunteer at our church.

Sid:   I’ll tell you what we’re out of time.

Sid:  We want everywhere to be a friend of God. My guest has written a book that helps people become a friend of God, it’s called “God’s Supernatural Power.” My guest is Bobby Connor who has just a marvelous gift of prophecy.  Bobby you said on yesterday’s broadcast you knew when attempt was made on your life of an abortion in your mother’s womb.  But what was the first time that you can recall hearing God’s audible voice?

Bobby:  Okay Sid, the first time I can really recall was when I was five years old my brother and sister had gone to public school and this was my first time to be by myself without a sibling.   And we’re in East Texas so I walk down behind my mother’s house which seems like a mile or so, but really it’s probably it’s two three hundred yards and I’m a little bitty blond headed five year kid, I walk down to this grove of trees and I lay down on my stomach and I’m laying on the grass and I put my hands on my face and my hands and I said out of my mouth. “Well, I guess I’ll have to be by myself.”  And when I said that a wind came, a wonderful wind came and got whirling around in the top of the tree above my head and a voice spoke to me out of the wind and said, “No Bobby, you’ll never be by yourself, see.”  And when this voice said, “See” the heavens, the sky rolled back just like you’d roll a scroll back and I saw what I thought was horses running back and forth across heaven with their mane and their tails on fire.  What it was, was angels but I’m a little boy from Texas so it looked like flaming horses.  And so I though everybody saw that so when I got around some little kids, my little friends I said, “Man I could see into the sky and they laughed at me and mocked me.”  So I thought I’ll never tell anybody that I could see into the sky.  But that was my first to ever have the voice of God speak to me where I knew that it was a supernatural thing.

Sid:  Well, you explained on yesterday’s broadcast how you went from a double barrel shot gun in your mouth to wanting to commit suicide to giving your heart to God.  But did many prophetic things happen to you over the years where you just knew things about people and you kept it to yourself?

Bobby:  Yes, before I was converted, I believe I got the gift when I was in my Momma’s womb, and then even when I was growing up I could tell if the telephone was going to ring and I could tell if my mother was going to drop a set of dishes or if somebody was going to walk into the room and what kind of conversation they were going to have.  And I thought that everybody was that way and then when I got converted the only friends I had were Baptist friends, and so when I finally told some of them they go “Oh no that’s not right.”  So then I tried to shun the gift and wouldn’t let it operate and then finally the Lord spoke to me and said, “Bobby I’ve got more power to direct you than the devil does to deceive you.”  So then I started letting the Holy Spirit do whatever He wanted to do.

Sid:  That’s amazing you were able to bust out of that box because I mean you’re taught theology these gifts aren’t for today and yet the gifts are operating.  Tell me the most significant thing one of the first most significant things were when you were able to use these gifts without being intimidated?

Bobby:  Okay, I’ll tell you a very this is one of the times the gift worked that was very beneficial for me.  Like I told you yesterday’s broadcast my father passed away, I never knew him and so my mother was in a very hard time and so one time a voice came to me and said, “Don’t get on that pony.”  Just a very strong voice, so I said, “What pony?”  And the voice said again, “Don’t get on that pony.”  So my brother was one year older than myself so I tell my brother, “Don’t get on that pony.”  And he said, “What pony, I said “I don’t know but just don’t get on that pony.”  And then this the strange thing my uncle came, my mother fixed our little clothes up and me and my mother and my brother and our little sack and clothes get into the car with our uncle and we drive for hours outside of Athens, Texas to up around Amarillo somewhere there.  And we pull into a long driveway, drive down to like a ranch house and so help me a woman walks up with a little bitty Shetland pony and two cowboy hats and she says, little boys get on the pony.  And I started screaming, “We’re not getting on that pony, we scooted over in the backseat and started screaming and crying and my mother started crying and said, “I can’t do it.”  But here’s what the deal was Sid, that was an orphan’s home and that’s how they would take the children away from the parents they would bring them to the car and let the little boys ride off on the pony and then the parents would drive off.  Isn’t that something?

Sid:  That is amazing.  Now I have to tell you something Bobby, I evaluate prophets on the accuracy of their prophecy.  Does the prophecy come to past and many times I’m disappointed, and many times I see the genuine gift.  I wonder if you could tell me a few prophecies that you have had that have come to pass.

Bobby:  Okay, yeah.  One was concerning George W. Bush becoming president of the United States. I got caught up into way up into heaven and I saw a light flashing and finally to make a long story short I asked the Lord, I said, “What do you want,” He said, I want George W. Bush to run for President and if the church will pray and really extend they’re intercessory prayer I’ll speak again to the nation again through a burning bush.”  And then He said, “Go to Washington, D.C. and prophecy this.  This was before George W. Bush chose to run for President and so that came to pass.  And then I…

Sid:  I have to ask you, now that you’re saying that, has God given you any insight into this current election?

Bobby:  Well, I’ll tell you what the Lord; to me the Lord’s been very silent concerning this coming election.  I’ll tell you, a couple of years ago since you’ve asked the question; a couple of years ago the Lord came to me and said of me, “Who do you want to be President?”  And I didn’t understand the severity of it, so I quick back at him and told him who I didn’t want to be President.  And then He rebuked me and said, “That is not the question that you were asked.”  And then so humbly I asked Him, “Who do you want to be President?”  And here’s what He told me, the only thing that I can genuinely say the Lord told me concerning this coming election is this.  He said, “If the church will pray, I will sustain the nation through dark days through a brown bag; it will be as the lad’s loaves and fishes,” that’s what He said.  Then He said, “Don’t tell anybody,” so I kept that for oh about a year and a half and then He said, “Now you can tell.”  I told then, Lou Engle and some other guys got the prophecy, but that’s the only thing…

Sid:  What does that prophecy mean?

Bobby:  I honestly don’t know, all I know was remember when Mike Huckleby, the guy’s asked him once, “How can you explain getting as far as you got with the least about of money that you’ve got and the least amount of support?”  He said, “The only way I can describe it is it’s like the lad’s loaves and fishes.”  So he used the very same terminology the Lord gave me, I don’t know but then I don’t have anything else from the Lord concerning it, but I know that it’s very important that the church pray and we get the right person in there.

Sid:  Are we going through some treacherous dark times in this country?

Bobby:  Very dark, the Bible said, “Watchman, watchman what do you see?”  And the watchman replied, “I see both things, light and night.”

Sid:  That’s my perception also, we’re going to have the best times in the world for true believer, and the worst times in the world for the world.

Bobby:  Yes, that’s exactly right; it’s Isaiah 60:1, “It’s time to rise and shine for our light has come, darkness is come across the people but the world’s light and glory will be upon His people.”

Sid:  Now I’m holding your new book “God’s Supernatural Power.” I’m very, very excited about what’s going to happen when people read this.  What type of feedback, it is a new book but what type of feedback are you getting on this book?

Bobby:  I’m getting a lot of good response. The number one response we get is that it is encouraging to people to realize that they have a destiny that they are not just some kind of a biological birth, that God preplanned their life and that He’s got a wonderful destiny for them.  And we try to show them who they are.  The first chapter deals with the identity crisis.  Heaven and hell both are posing the exact same question to every person on earth.  Heaven God, hell the devil.  They’re asking the very same question; they’re synchronized on what they’re asking the people and here it is. “Who do you think you are?”  And see what the Bible says “What the person thinks, so they are going to live.”  And so we need our opinion about ourself changed; God has confidence in this generation, or he’d never let us live in this crucial hours.  One of my favorite verses Sid right now is Philippians 2:13.  “It is God that works in you both to will and to do of His good pleasure.”  And boy can you imagine the creature doing something that would bring the creator good pleasure.  So I found out what that is, it’s Luke 12:32, “It’s your Father’s good pleasure to give you the kingdom.”  So that’s what the book deals with.

Sid:  And you know what I catch from your book though?  It’s time to get out of the audience and become a performer rather than a spectator.

Bobby:  That right, you know He says “The kingdom of God doesn’t come just with talk but with action.”  So that’s what we’ve got to do, I love what the Lord told me once, He said, “Tell My people that they’re about to believe what they know.”  It’s going to move from the head to the heart to the hands.”  It’s going to move from head knowledge to real heart faith and then actually become doers of the Word and not just hearers only.

Sid:  And a book of this nature is so important at this moment because I believe God’s up to something new, I believe in the atmosphere.  Whereas the things you prayed and you didn’t see results you’re going to be crying now, assuming you haven’t given up, and you’re going to start seeing results.

Bobby:  We are in a time of God’s favor, 2^nd Corinthians 6: 1 & 2.  We’re in a time of God’s help and God’s favor that Paul said, “It’s the acceptable time, it’s a time of God’s favor, a time when God will help us.” I’m very excited to see the day that we’re in.  I believe we’re in Hosea 10:12.  That verse said, “It is time to seek the Lord until He comes and reigns righteousness upon us.”

Sid:  You mention an intriguing thing in your book, “That the Lord is looking for friends.”  What do you mean by that?

Bobby:  Oh, I love John 15:15 He said, “I don’t call you a servant any longer I call you a friend.”  And friend’s really communicate with one another, and I believe it is probably one of the highest accolade that we could receive being called a friend of the Lord.

Sid:  My guest is red hot for the Messiah, his name is Bobby Connor. He is a prophet and we were talking about his gift.  One of the things that I have found Bobby, and it’s really amazing to me, even before people becoming believers in the Messiah many that have the gift of prophecy are operating in it but they don’t even understand what it is.  Was that true with you?

Bobby:  I believe that’s true. People ask me “When was your first experience with the Lord Jesus?” I tell them it is very strange, but it’s the absolute truth.  I was in my mother’s womb, I was a fetus in my mother’s womb and my mother was very desperate because my dad was dying in a mental institution from a venereal disease, it had settled in his brain.  He was dying a lunatic in an insane asylum and the doctors, this is 1943, came in and informed my mother that the baby in her belly would be afflicted the same disease that was killing my father.  So my mother was desperate because she already had two children, my sister two years old, and myself, and my bother one year old older, who was born crippled.  And so while my mom was desperate so she took a coat hanger, made it into a hook, opened her womb inserted the coat hanger and attempted to pull me out of there.  And it was at that point that the Hand of the Lord came and pushed me aside and kept my mother from extracting my life out of her body.  I told my wife what I had just told you and my wife…

Sid:  But wait, just out of curiosity how did you know this?  I mean you’re in your mother’s womb?

Bobby:  I’m in my mother womb, I’m no bigger than a golf ball, and I’m really the size of a cantaloupe at this time and the hand of the Lord pushed me aside, I saw it just as clear anything in the world.  So I told my wife and my wife said, “Bobby how could anybody know what happened to him when he was a fetus?”  I said, “I don’t know, but me and John the Baptist do.”  Remember John the Baptist got full of the Holy Ghost in his mommy’s tummy and then I quoted the verses Jeremiah 1:4, “before I formed thee in the belly I knew you, before you come out of your mommy’s tummy I ordained you and sanctified you to be a Prophet to the nations.”  So that’s my first experience with the Lord, but that is absolutely true.  Your question was, “Do you think that people can receive a prophetic anointing even before they know what it is?”  And I believe the answer to that is yes.

Sid:  Now, obviously your mother wasn’t successful with the coat hanger and you’re telling me you were aware that God literally moved you or the coat hanger?

Bobby:  I’m telling you exactly what happened, the hand of the Lord came inside my momma’s body and pushed me to the side and covered me in the hallow of His hand while she tried to extract me out with a coat hanger.  I’ll tell you what happened, later on my mother she comes to one of our meetings, I was doing a demonstration of God’s power meeting at a civic center and this was the first time that my Mother had ever seen the supernatural power of God moving through me.  And so it just shook her to the very core and she was broken and she tries to tell me that story that I just told you.  I put my arm around her and told her, “I said, oh Momma I already know all about that.”

Sid:  Huh, out of curiosity was anyone in your family or heritage a prophet?

Bobby:  Okay, now see I never knew my Dad, never got to see him. I didn’t know any of his people, so I know absolutely nothing about my father’s side of the people.  I’ve only seen one picture of my father and that was just a small little Kodak picture so I don’t know for sure, but I believe there must have been somebody in the lineage that had a real call and a connection with God because God supernaturally spared me and I believe we’re just somehow had grace on us because somebody prayed for us.

Sid:  Now understand that every Yom Kippur God gives you revelation as to what will be happening.

Bobby:  Yes, for the past thirteen years on the day of Atonement visitation from the Lord.  And He’ll come tell us some of the things that’s going to happen in the future.

Sid:  Tell me one thing that is going to, that He told you this last day of atonement.

Bobby:  Okay, He told me this last day of atonement for 2008 He said, “There’s going to come a Kingdom company that’s going to have dominion demeanor, and they’re going to rule the visible realm from the invisible realm and they’re going to rule it from a platform of love.   He said, “What’s missing in the body of Christ today is real compassion for Jesus Christ, He said, we’ve got to go back to Revelations 2.”  Remember the church at Ephesus; it said it had great deeds, they had great doctrine, but they had left their first love.  And I believe the missing note right now is the love of God.  And God is about to baptize the Body of Christ with 1^st Corinthians 13 love.  It’s the next great move of God, it’s waiting right at the door right now.

Sid:  Well, let’s find out a little bit more about you.  This is hard, what you just told me was hard to believe about the coat hanger and being aware of it I mean.  But at age eight you started drinking, how does someone at age eight start drinking?

Bobby:  Oh I was raised in a very very coarse family; nearly every one of them in my family were alcoholics except a couple of aunts.  But you know they drank alcohol and the first time I got drunk I was eight years old, I found wine in my grandfather’s storm cellar, this is in East Texas the sand hills of East Texas. So it was Christmas time I found wine.  I drank this wine and got intoxicated but when I was intoxicated I could fantasize and be anybody I wanted to be and it was at that moment that the enemy really began to hook me with alcohol.  And from that time on I drank shaving lotion, shoe polish, sniffed glue, gasoline and then as we grew on up I’d break into hospitals get their drugs, put them in a sack, shake them up and take a hand full of them and sit there to see what would happen.  I look back now and I realize that was the devil attempting to erase my mind, but God is very faithful.  I actually got converted in the fall of 1968. I had tried everything the world had, the wild life, the drinking, the partying, then they said what you need is a wife and a kid and a white frame house and a job and I got all of that and I was still just as empty as ever so I said, “If this is all there is I’m through with life.  And I was absolutely, I meant that with all my hear so I carried my wife and my little boy, who is now forty-two, carried them to church, let them out and I drove off.

Sid:  Now just out of curiosity was your wife born again then?

Bobby:  Okay when we got married she wasn’t, she’s a good moral girl, she didn’t do like all the rest of the girls did but she was a good moral person but didn’t know Jesus.  And then she started going to church when she got pregnant because she wanted to a better life for our child.  And then she comes in one day and she’s born again.  Awe man and I hated that.

Sid:  Why? Why did you hate that?

Bobby:  Okay, here is what happened to me, remember I told you we had very very poor, my dad died, my mother raised three of us on $29 a month, this is not $29 a month per child, $29 a month for three children and we were very poor.  My mom made our clothes out of feed sack, the farmers back in those days would get their cattle feed in cloth bags and they’d give them to my mother, she’d wash them out, cut them out to make little clothes.  And she’d catch a ride, we didn’t have a car, she would get out on highway 31 in East Texas and thumb a ride and carry us to church.  Now I’m a little bitty primary boy and we’re standing at a desk at a Baptist Church and singing a song and we’re singing one Sunday morning, Jesus loves me this I know for the Bible tells me so.  And a voice spoke to me, a cold calculating voice spoke in the spirit realm and said, “Bobby God doesn’t love you, if God loved you you’d have shoes on your feet, you’d have clothes like other kids and you’d have a family and a father.”  And I did a horrible thing, at that moment as a little bitty boy I listened to that voice and the moment I listened to that voice that’s when hatred came into my heart towards God.  I felt like God had shafted me, that He wasn’t good, that He wasn’t trustworthy. See the enemy He’s not a good devil at all, he fight unfair, he fights anyway he can and so he poison and polluted my mind about God and that’s one of things that really opened the door to alcohol and all that kind of stuff.

Sid:  Now, so that then you were really upset that your wife starts going to church.

Bobby:  God born again, ah huh.

Sid:  Ah, what’d you do about it, did you just let her go?

Bobby:  Oh this is horrible, she kneeled down to pray for me, I’d kick her over, she’d get dressed up for church, I’d tear her clothes off of her, rough her up.  I’d watch her go back in the house, make her face back up, put on a new dress, a different dress and start walking eight miles to church, me cursing her.

Sid:  Eight miles one way?

Bobby:  Eight miles to church, but I’ll tell you what I wouldn’t give her the keys to the car you know.  But I’m telling you she was faithful, she wouldn’t give up.  That night in 1968 when I got born again it was a Wednesday night I had carried her to church and let her and my little son out, I intended to kill myself that night.  And that’s when the Lord really spoke to me.

Sid:  How did you attempt to kill yourself?

Bobby:  I drove my car deep into the forest woods down in Kickapoo Creek. I took a double barrel shotgun and I had it loaded with buckshot and I stuck the barrel in the roof of my mouth, put the safety off, put my thumb on the trigger and the car filled with demons just like that, it got as cold as ice in this car.  And the demons began to chant “Do it, do it, do it.”  And then all of a sudden I started trembling.  I mean trembling like a leaf and I put the gun on safety, threw it in the back seat of the car. It’s about 9:00 at night now, and I drive back to the church where I let them out about 6:00 that afternoon and I’m setting under a big old tree and I’m just… boy I had had it and so here’s what I said, now this is a pretty poor prayer to pray to get saved but, “Jesus looks at our heart, not our mouth, that’s when I said, “Lord,” I said, Jesus if You could would You change my life.”  And when I said that just like that He stepped into my life; I’m telling you the hatred, the hatred went out the bitterness when out, all the stuff that had happened.  So I get out of the car, walked to the back door, it’s about 9:30 at night, I pull the back door of the church open and here’s what I see Sid.  I see my wife, my little son, the preacher a man by the name of Paul in the house and several young Christian couples, they’re at an old fashion mourners bench, a prayer altar and their crying out, “Oh God, oh God, whatever it takes save Bobby.”  And see now, if they hadn’t been in intercession I’d pull the trigger, I’d be in hell today instead of speaking on this radio broadcast.”

Sid:  So when you saw that, “What did you do?”

Bobby:  Oh I ran forward, fell on that preachers neck, see I hated him, oh I hated the air he breathed man. I’d catch him in stores prior to that time, I’d shove him, I’d curse him.  I mean it was demonic and that was what it was.  And he’d look at me, he was a German man and he’d look at me with tears and blue eyes and here’s what he’d say to me, “Bobby, I love you.”  I knew he meant it but I wasn’t going to respond to it.  I fell on his neck Sid and cried like a baby man and then I finally I turned him loose and I picked my wife up.  And I pulled her to me and for the first time I knew what it meant to love out of a pure hear and that night the Lord told me He said, “I’m going to send you around the world with the gospel.”

Sid:  You go from a shotgun in your mouth to killing yourself in the same night to being given a vision that you’re going to travel the world and tell people about Jesus?

Bobby:  Travel the world and tell people about Jesus, I said to Him, “Fat chance.”  That’s what I said.  But boy He’s been faithful.

Sid:  Well, He said that you’re going to go around the world, have you?

Bobby:  Yes, we’ve been preaching for thirty-eight years now, and we average speaking five times a week for thirty-eight years.  And we go all over the earth; we go a couple of place now a week.

Sid:  Well, I’ll tell you something, I am very intrigued over your prophetic gift and we’ll get into that on tomorrow’s broadcast.

Sid:  I can tell you I want your faith to be unshakable, that’s the operative word.  I want your faith in the integrity and the honesty and love of God and Word of God to be unshakable.  And I have a book in my hands that is necessary mentoring material.  There’s such a misunderstanding about why God allows tragedy, or even how to respond to tragedy, or how to get your miracle in the midst of tragedy.  And that’s why I’m interviewing Ben Godwin about his brand new book “God’s Strategy for Tragedy”, and it has within the book one of the best documented modern day miracles I have ever seen, it nails it down Ben.  There is nothing anyone could say about when they see an X-ray then there’s 3 inches of bone missing, and they see the next X-ray and it’s totally restored.  I mean there’s nothing anyone can say as far as it has to be a miracle, could bone just grow like that?

Ben:  No, what you’re looking at is the sovereign handiwork of God.

Sid:  Well, I said, 2 days ago there were going to be miracles and although we didn’t pray, in fact you were telling me just during worship a great miracle occurred, tell me about that.

Ben:  Yes, I was in a preacher’s conference up in Tennessee years ago, and we were in the middle of just the worship service, no one was preaching, no one was ministering to the sick. A preacher who was up on the platform had walked in and out of the services it was a 10 day conference.  So I had seen him many times with crutches and it was laborious, tedious for him to try and climb upon the platform with those crutches, very difficult for him to walk.  And all of a sudden in the middle of a song, people were just praising God rejoicing, this man just threw his crutches down and started jumping and running all over the building.  And of course there was just an eruption of praise because we realized that this was not the work of a man nobody laid hands on him, this was the sovereign work of God.

Sid:  And this is where we’re headed, I believe that when we come into corporate worship meetings no one will be laying hands on people, there won’t be words of knowledge, there won’t be prophecies, we won’t need any of that, just as a matter of fact that prayer meeting that you were at when you received your healing there was such a tangible presence of God that the woman that prayed for you you told me she had to crawl on her hands and knees.

Ben:  That’s correct she was overwhelmed with the Spirit of God. I believe as we approach the coming of Jesus in these latter times there will be an escalation of supernatural events.  We know that there’s more demonic activity, we know that evil is increasing, but I believe by the same token God is going to respond with a greater outpouring of His Spirit than we have ever seen.  The prophet said, “The glory of the latter house will be greater than the glory of the former house.”  And I think back to when Solomon dedicated the temple the glory cloud, the shekinah glory of God came in so thick, so strong that the priest could not even stand to minister; totally overwhelmed by the Spirit of God.

Sid:  Ben, you must have extraordinary unshakable faith for people with bone problems I would have to believe.

Ben:  Yes, I do have a strong faith in that area because this goes back to why sometimes God allows tragedy; sometimes He allows it prepare us to minister to other people.  If you remember when Peter denied Jesus, Jesus said to Him, “Simon Satan desired to have you that he may sift you as wheat but I prayed for you that your faith failed not and when you’re converted strengthen your brethren.”  In other words Peter once you’ve come through this experience you’re going to be able to reach back and help somebody else.

Sid:  Well listen I know somebody right now, I know God is healing necks and healing bones and I know that if you pray right now there’s going to be, we’re going to have more miracles then we’ve ever had in the history of this ministry right at this moment if you’ll pray Ben.

Ben:  Praise God, Amen, we’ll just agree right now.  Heavenly Father we release the anointing of the Holy Spirit to go forth to touch those that are listening to this broadcast; I’m believing while they’re driving down the road, while their working in their house, wherever they are that miracles are going to occur, that their faith is going to soar; God we just believe pain is leaving bodies right now.  We believe that people are going to have full recoveries of health; people that have been given up on; people that have no hope we’re believing for the sovereign divine intervention of God and we release our faith, we release that anointing right now. We claim the glory of God visiting the listeners to this program, and I believe that testimonies are going to pour in of what God has done.  And it’s all for the glory of the name of Jesus, the one and only Son of God.

Sid:  And a left ear has just opened, Spirit of deafness I command you to leave from either the left or the right ear; ears open and backs are being healed.  I mean there’s so many bone problems where people are being healed right now, but it’s very important that if you are driving to pull to side of the road, get out of your car, be careful get out of your car and just bend over.  In other words, faith without a corresponding action is dead.  Ben I’m excited about what God’s doing right now!

Ben:  Praise God, I feel something wonderful taking place.

Sid:  Going back to your book, “God’s Strategy for Tragedy”, I mean this literally would make someone’s faith unshakable no matter what the devil tries to throw at them.  But comment a bit about God’s timing.

Ben:  One of the things that I try to do in the book is not only document my story, and not only go into why God allows tragedy and how we should respond, but one of the things that I really feel strongly about is guiding people into a receptive position to receive miracles in their life.  I’ll never forget hearing the story about a prominent minister who was approached by a skeptic, and the skeptic said just emphatically “I don’t believe in miracles.” to which the minister wisely responded by saying “When you need a miracle, then you will start believing in them.”  And I believe that sometimes God will allow us to come to a place of desperation to where we will really reach out and call upon God.  And in my book I talk about how to get yourself in a receptive position.  And one of the ways to do that is by realizing the power of prayer.  One of my favorite quotes is that “Prayer moves the hand that moves the hand that moves the world.”  It taps you into a supernatural source and you know James said in James 4:2 “We have not because we ask not.”  And I think that God wants to heal people more than we want Him to, it’s just a matter of getting into a receptive position where we can receive what He already has provided for us.

Sid:  You know what I’m also thinking, there is such power in the testimony you talked about the gaping wound that you had when you had your accident. I have heard recently of people being healed of scars just disappearing.  I don’t know if you ever prayed for this to happen but would you pray for scars to disappear?

Ben:  Certainly.  Lord, I just believe that you are going to remove even the reminders of the pain and the suffering that people have been in.  God I just believe you can make that skin whole, you can make that skin as new and as fresh as a baby’s skin.  Lord, just soothe those reminders not only of the physical scars, but the emotional scars that some people have.  And Lord You can bring good out of bad; You can give beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for morning and the garment of praise for Spirit of heaviness.  We give You praise for doing it right now in Jesus name.

Sid:  There is such a strong presence of God I am serious if you have a pain anywhere in your body especially backs and necks and hips and bones.  With the presence of God that’s pouring out right now, if you will just bend, if you’ll just move your neck, if you will do something you’re going to walk right into that healing and it could be something that isn’t pain and you won’t know like high blood pressure or diabetes.  But by faith jump up and down and say thank you Jesus 2000 years ago you did it and I receive it now in Jesus name.

Sid:  We want everyone everywhere to have so much fun in the Lord and one of the ways to have fun in the Lord is to see your children and your grandchildren sold out on fire for Jesus.  And I have an end time mentoring tool so that this next generation, if we even have forty years, this next generation will be able to not walk in the disadvantages we’ve walked in; that we would be able to literally nip the devil in the bud just before he tries to sabotage our children and our grandchildren.  I have Mike Shreve’s new book just off the press called “God’s Promises for Your Children.”  In which he has found that there is 65 distinct promises in God’s Word that you can pray to God, pray let the devil know you’re aware of it.  And not only does he write these promises in the word, but then he has an explanation of the promises and then he actually writes the prayer out for you and allows space for you to write in the name of your children or the name of your grandchildren.  It’s going to take a few minutes every day and it’s literally going to change their destiny, it’s going to enhance your relationship with Him.  They will fulfill their destiny, it’s like if some of them are lost, if some of them are real challenged, with the word of God you can take that sword and you go in and you prepare the way for them to get out.  And woe is me if I don’t do this for this for my children, I’m prophesying to myself, but I’m also prophesying to you…But on yesterday’s broadcast Mike Shreve we were talking about your son when he’s 4 years old.  How would you like your son to walk up to you and say “Mom & Dad, I died in my sleep,” what happened Mike?

Mike:  Well he didn’t actually die, that was his perception of it, but I believe he did have an out of body experience with God because what he said to rehearse it completely came down oh about 6:00 in the morning and said, “Mommy, Daddy I died in my sleep last night and Jesus took me to heaven.  And then he began to just describe some of things that he saw and heard, and he was using words we never heard him use before.  For instance he said that “Jesus told him to always have compassion on all people.”  Well, he never used the word compassion and didn’t even know what it meant.  And then the Lord was real practical with him too, the Lord told him and said “Now don’t ever watch bad TV,” and He spoke that to him.  And we were convinced that it wasn’t a figment of his imagination the glow about him, his demeanor, the atmosphere around him we could tell that he’d had had a genuine experience with God, and I believe that he did have a heavenly experience.  But that was on the basis of one of the promises that God’s given, it’s Isaiah 54 verse 13 where the scripture says, “All your children shall be taught by the Lord and great shall be the peace of your children.”  And there’s only so much that we can do as parents as far as instructing our children concerning Biblical truth. Then it takes a revelation from God to make it really penetrate their lives.  So when we move off of what we can do instructing them in God’s word then God takes up with His supernatural ability to transform them from within and that’s exactly what He’s done for my son and my daughter.  Another great promise is Matthew chapter 18 verse 10 where Jesus was talking about children, and He said, “Take heed that you do not despise one of these little ones for I say to you that in heaven their angels always see the face of My Father who is in heaven.”  I find that to be a very intriguing promise.  First of all the angels are simultaneously conscious of every activity of our child and the face of God as well. I thought how can that be, how can they always beholding the face of the Father and always beholding the activity of a child?  Then I realized in the heavenly sphere there’s no distance, there’s no time and they can be simultaneously aware of both.  But that’s an encouraging thing to claim for your child, angelic protection in his or her life.

Sid:  This must be very important because just before you started quoting that scripture I opened your book at random and I happen to be on page 51 and it’s called “Angelic Protection.”  It’s the exact scripture you were quoting. Why don’t you turn to page 51 and just explain the scripture, what it means, and then pray that prayer and explain how they write in the name of their children and grandchildren.

Mike:  Well, in the explanation of that passage I talk about how this is actually a promise for all children and if it’s a promise for every single child in the world how much more it is a promise concerning the children that are in a covenant relationship with God.  I believe we have even more so angelic protection around us, the Angel of the Lord camps round about those that fear Him to deliver them.  And Hebrew 1:14 says that “God sent forth His angels as ministering spirits that will minister to the heirs of salvation.”  And so we have ministering spirits in our homes, all around our families, our children, our sons, our daughters that are watching over them continuously.  Now as you mentioned after each promise and after explanation, I have a prayer confession. Incidentally let me preface it with this, the God of heaven is called the Lord of Hosts, the true God the living God, it’s referred to as the Lord of Hosts and that is a name for God that means the God of an army of angels that are poised and ready for battle.  So I start out the prayer recognizing that title of God, I say “Lord God You are the Lord of hosts, the God of an army of angels who are poised and ready for battle, and I confess that at least one angel is assigned to constantly watch over.” Then you can insert the name of your child to insure Divine protection and provision in his life. “According to Your word many centuries ago just one angel brought total defeat to the entire Assyrian army.  So one angel in my child’s life if sufficient to bring deliverance in every area of need; yet I believe that there are many ministering spirits actively engaged in ministering to our family that we might inherit all of the benefits of salvation.  I praise you God for this very thing taking place right now in Jesus name Amen.”  And you can pray that prayer over your child every day and I guarantee you that it will intensify the spiritual warfare in behalf of that child because as you believe and expect angelic protection to be sent forth I believe all the more it will take place.

Sid:  Well, you know and I’m looking at the prayer just before that which is called “Proclaimer’s of God’s Word” from Isaiah 59:21.  Explain that.

Mike:  Well, vision is generational and I believe God many times stirs our hearts with a certain anointing, a certain revelation of His word that we are then called to pass down to the next generation and the generation after that.  And this promise concerns that, Isaiah 59:21 God says, “As for Me says the Lord, this is My covenant with them, My Spirit who is upon you and My words which I have put in your mouth shall not depart out of your mouth, nor from the mouth of your descendants, nor from the mouth of your descendants, descendants says the Lord from this time and for ever more.”  So I have a particular revelation of God’s word and Sid you have a particular revelation of God’s word, and God is saying “I’m going to transfer this revelation, this specific understanding from you to the next generation and to the following generation forevermore!”  And what a powerful thing to pray for your child that the understanding of God’s word that you have a Christians believer, as a believer in the Messiah, the understanding that you have is being transferred to your son to your daughter and then you have a confession on that same page that you can confess over your offspring that that very thing will take place.

Sid:  I’m thinking that in this age that we’re living in everyone’s looking at how much can the government do for our children, let’s change generations, let’s take care of their health insurance, let’s take care of everything that they need.  But you realize that number one we can’t do that, and number two your book would change in a generation.

Mike:  I believe that.

Sid:  If you were running for President you could say “I’m going to put one of these books in every pot.

Mike:  And I’d be glad to do that, praise God we need to take our nation back!  I was impressed recently with the fact that in Hebrews chapter 11, that’s called faith hall of fame, and it mentions all the great patriarchs and leaders of old who by faith accomplished this is accomplished that.  Well, one thing that really penetrated my heart is that a majority of all the incidents mentioned in Hebrew’s 11 involved the preservation of our seed, the bringing forth of the seed the preservation of the seed, the impartation of the anointing to the seed.  Just to mention a few verse 7 “By faith Noah being warned of God of things not seen as yet moved with fear prepared an ark to the saving of his house.”  So that was talking about the preservation of the seed through faith.  Then verse 11 “Through faith Sarah received strength to conceive seed and was delivered of a child when she was passed age.”  Then it goes on verse 12 “Therefore spring there one and him as good a dead and as many of the stars of sky in multitude.”  Then verses 20 and 21 are powerful, “By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau concerning thing to come.”  Then verse 21 “By faith Jacob when he was a dying blessed both of his sons of Joseph and worshipped leaning on the top of his staff.  So over and over again God is showing how that by faith there’s an impartation to the next generation so that the work of God can go on from one generation to the next.  And that’s why I believe that this book is prophetically important because this generation is under attack with evil like we never saw.  I came up in the hippy generation and it was bad then, I would dare to say that it’s ten times worse now with the corruption the children are facing.

Sid:  My guest is red hot for the Messiah. Imagine three encounters with a gigantic angel that started in August of 2002, and one of these encounters, my guest Keith Miller was given a scroll and ate it and it’s come out in the new book that we’re offering, “Surrender to the Spirit.”   But tell me about that third encounter you had with the same angel.

Keith:  Yeah, it happened it was pretty awesome because the first one in August and the second was September each month for three months there was a fresh encounter unexpected. Something I didn’t want to sense, but it was after the second encounter I began to dive into the Word on the strength and the stature of the Lord, as I shared yesterday.  But the third encounter I had actually for my first time back out to minister since the August encounter was in a church in Hobbs, New Mexico and they had previously booked me months before the encounters ever took place they had booked me for a set of meetings called Seven Days of Glory.  And it was awesome because at the time we booked it we had no idea that this was going to take place. So I went over to the church, and one of the things the Lord had promised me and what I had been asking for was where ever we went that we would minister out of His counsel.  And so when I got to the church there in Hobbs I was going to start Sunday morning and go all the way through Saturday. That Sunday morning I told the pastor I said, “Hey this is October 2002 I said I just need to have a little bit of time with the Lord if I could.”  And he said, “Okay just take my office” and so I went into his office and I just lay down on the floor and I sat there in his office.  And I just began to ask the Lord I said, “Lord I want Your heart, Your counsel what do you want to do in this set of meetings, what do You want to accomplish, what’s going to be longevity something that’s not a visitation but something that You are going to establish here in the realm of the Kingdom.”  And then all of a sudden as I’m praying, now back and lifted up into another encounter very similar as the first one. It’s like boom and I’m in the encounter.  And as I was in the encounter I was instantly in the throne room before the throne of the Lord.  And how I can best describe it was that in Matthew Jesus describes in Matthew 24 “He says I go to the right hand side of the power today and that’s what it was.”  I’m telling you, that’s what it was and it was like a real heavy incredible high power, holy incredible power like every fiber of my being was just just whew, it was just like this incredible holiness and purity and I was just undone again.  And I was just like this huge white incredible white glory power and I was just standing there and I was just looking and I was beholding the scene and then all of a sudden that same angel was on the right hand side of the throne.  As he was standing there and I’m trying and I’m literally going what is going on?  And all of a sudden the angel that I could see the hand of the Lord, I could literally make out his hand and inside his hand was an envelope and he handed the envelope to the angel and the angel walks over to me, hands me the envelope and I am so undone I’m shaking, I drop the envelope and the angel of the Lord picks it back up and hands it to me. I open up the envelope and there was no paper in the envelope, it wasn’t like there was anything in the envelope but the message was the envelope if you would.  I really don’t understand the fullness of that, but it was just like it was in the envelope, I didn’t pull out a piece of paper, but the message was in the envelope and there was two scriptures and the two scriptures were Revelation 4:5 and Isaiah 11:2 and then I was out of the encounter.

Sid:  And very briefly tell me what these two scriptures say.

Keith:  Revelation 4:5 is an incredible passage where it describes the seven fold flow, but it says “and from the throne proceedings lightning, thunders and voices and seven lamps of fire were burning before the throne which are the Seven Spirits of God.”  And then Isaiah 11:2, and you know at that time I’ll tell you I didn’t even know what seven Spirits of God were. I said, “Seven Spirits, I don’t understand that.”  And then Isaiah 11:2 “The Spirit of the Lord shall rest upon Him, the Spirit of Wisdom, the Spirit of Understanding, the Spirit of Counsel and Might, the Spirit of knowledge and the Fear of the Lord.”  And that was the two scriptures that were in the message that the Angel of Lord handed me.

Sid:  And what did this mean to you after you reflected on it?

Keith:  At first I really didn’t understand it and in fact that seven days of meetings were incredible meetings because it was like He had given me a foretaste of what this anointing was going to release. I’d begin to minister out of the realm of God in those seven days that I would look at people and I would hear the Lord tell me what was wrong with them, and I would tell them and then I’d tell them things about their mother or their daughter and steel bars disappeared out people’s back and people were healed.

Sid:  And you mean that someone that had a steel bar because a doctor put it in there disappeared.

Keith:  Yeah, they couldn’t…

Sid:  That’s what I thought you said.

Keith:  Yes, they could not bend over, there was no way they could bend over because of a bad back and had a bar, a steel rod and we hit a… after that Sunday morning service from that point on those seven days was seven days of glory and we saw more than one time steel disappear names, addresses, diseases, people that weren’t even in the meetings.  Somebody’s daughter with a rare blood disease and just an incredible, and I really felt like it was the Lord saying, and at that time I didn’t know what was going on I just had the encounter, the two passages. I would spend all day looking up what does that mean, I don’t understand this Lord and I was just during the day studying and at night we would have the revival meetings and it was just incredible, just incredible demonstration of the power of the Holy Spirit in a way that I’ve never seen before.  I dreamed about those things, I mean some of the days like A.A. Allen some of these guys, and there’s a promise that we all know that what He did formerly will always be greater in the latter.  And so I began to touch something in the Spirit and I said, “Oh my gosh,” and then after that seven day meeting I went home and I tried to find everything  I could on it, but there wasn’t much out there.  I couldn’t find anything, what is the seven Spirits of God? I thought I better be careful here because there’s only one Holy Spirit but seven Spirits I don’t understand this. So it began a journey for me that moment that I began to search out those deep things of God and begin to pray and dive into the Word, and He began to teach me on what are the seven fold flow?  Who are the Seven anointing, seven functions, seven different rivers if you would of the precious Holy Spirit of a believers life because Jesus himself said, in John 7 that out of your belly shall flow rivers, not just a river but rivers that’s multiple flow.  Job 29:6 says that the rock poured out rivers of oil for me.  I believe that it ties right in with that lampstand, and also with the wells that Isaac re-dug; the seven wells or the wells that he and he renamed that last well the well of the seven and the fullness of the Holy Spirit.

Sid:  What excites me is not just that you’re teaching on this but this teaching is so pregnant with the Spirit of God that people receive impartations on these seven Spirits of God.

Keith:  That’s right, in the beginning of Azusa Street the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, it wasn’t just a good teaching, it became something that the Lord was bringing forth for the Body of Christ to see revival. Then we know that He began to bring forth the understanding of the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

Sid:  And speaking of gifts of the Holy Spirit you had quite a move of God’s Spirit in Pennsylvania briefly tell me about that.

Keith:  Yeah, it was awesome we went for a four day weekend and it ended up exploding for ten weeks.  So it’s twelve states, thirty different denominations came during the meetings and also touched the college, we saw incredible we saw warlocks get born again.  People that were actually worshipping the devil came into the meeting with the intent of messing with the meetings, pentagram on and everything. The power of God touched them and they got born again and to this day they are still serving the Lord.  So we just saw an incredible breakout on revival there in Pennsylvania.

Sid:  Well, on tomorrow’s broadcast, speaking of a breakout of God’s Spirit, I would like you to talk about what God showed you about the Spirit of Wisdom and when that came upon you. How your life was changed, and do you know what I believe I believe that when you teach on the Spirit of Wisdom that’s what’s going to be transferred as you’re teaching on that.  Have you had any other encounters where you’ve been taken to heaven?

Keith:  Yes, I have I’ve had several encounters prophetic encounters where I’ve seen different aspects like the Lord in counsel showed me different things of even establishing the wells of the old in the areas of those that have gone before us.  And how we honor those establishing what they released upon the earth by the power of the Holy Ghost.  But one of the recent things that we’ve had encountered was we were, Janet and I my precious wife, were just sitting in the front room and we’d just got through with a series of meetings and all of a sudden… the night before I had been woken up and I literally heard the majestic sounds of heaven.  And when I say majestic I literally could hear the deep worship and the majestic splendor of God…

Sid:  Ooops, were out of time we’ll pickup here on tomorrow’s broadcast.

Sid:  My guest, John McTernan has updated his book the title “As America has Done to Israel.” He documents that within most times 24 hours of the United States trying to divide the land of Israel or doing something anti-Jewish or anti-Israel, there have been in modern times the five worst economic disasters to hit America all connected with our relationship of Israel.  You would think that everyone would read this book and understand it and understand the supernatural connection of blessing or curses based on our attitude towards Israel.  And I know that this one of John’s biggest frustrations, but I had asked you and I said, “John do you know if Congressman, Senators, the President, the Vice President, the Supreme Court Justices I mean the influences makers and the world have read this book?” You started to answer that.

John:  Well, Sid there have been two copies that I know of that have been of my book that have been given to President Bush.  I was contacted by a congressman from Indiana awhile back and this was what happened, his wife somehow got a copy of my book.  And it would be interesting I never asked her how she got a copy of my book and anyway she read it. As she was reading the things like we’ve been discussing of the show Sid she was telling her husband, he’s a Congressman from Indiana and he’s a Republican Congressman and they got so, he didn’t read the book his book was related to him what I had written in the book the connection about dividing the land of Israel and all these awesome things that were happening to America.  And Sid they immediately went to the Whitehouse without making an appointment, they wanted to see the President to give him a copy of the book; they went to the Whitehouse and he was not in.  They spoke to one of the President’s advisors who assured them that the President would be given the book and he received a letter about a week later from President Bush saying that he had received the book and he thanked him.  Now whether the President read it or not I don’t know.

Sid:  I know, I can’t image any man or woman of God reading this book and wanting to be on the flipside on God’s judgment.

John:  But God did get the book to him, it was literally put on his desk in the Whitehouse.

Sid:  But let’s switch gears for just a second, okay you pointed out that within 24 hours of the United States latest orchestration of dividing up Jerusalem to make it Palestinian one part, and making it Jewish the other part, and also forming a Palestinian State.  Within 24 hours the most recent attempt under the Bush Administration we had Hurricane Ike, we had the rumblings of something of, if you or I had even prophesied this a year ago people would think that we were nuts, that some of the largest financial institutions in America.  The rocks if you will are shaking.

John:  Yes Sid.

Sid:  Continue.

John:  Sid as I had mentioned on the previous show about the revelation that America is working to divide Jerusalem.  We had the beginning of this, it’s not sort of the beginning, but it’s a major unraveling of our economy, and actually as the revelation came out Lehman Brothers bank had failed and actually did fail $639 billion.  And Sid from that day on back at that period of time, the stock market, the banks, the whole economy of the United States started to come to a grinding halt.  Sid when the President gave his speech about the need to get $700 billion, almost a trillion dollars coming from government money, to keep the banks and Wall Street a float. Right in the midst of that he met with Mahmoud Abbas from the Palestinians to divide Jerusalem.  I have this here right in front of me, it’s dated September 25th, this is what comes from the Washington Times, “The US financial crisis is at center stage at the Whitehouse on Thursday, that’s September 25^th when the two presidential candidates Barack Obama and John McCain and Congressional leaders meet the discuss rescue plans, the United State financial markets.

Sid:  How could the United States gasping for air economically speaking, he could even have an appointment with the head of the Palestinians?

John:  Well Sid, I don’t know you would think he would cancel it.  Now listen to this, “Mideast Peace was the topic of Bushes talks with Abbas. Peace talks were re-launched at the U.S. hosted Summit last November with prodding from the U.S. Israel and Palestinians set a yearend target for reaching a final peace accord that would end the six decades of the hostilities.”  Now I’m not going to read any more Sid, but Abbas met with Bush before Bush gave his you know the final speech there about the 700 billion dollars going into the stock market, into the banks.  On that very day he met with Abbas in the Whitehouse to divide Jerusalem Sid.

Sid:  Now the reason I have you on the air this week is that you have received a prophetic word about America from the Lord, and I would like you to share the circumstances and share that word now.

John:  Sid, there is a certain way that I hear from the Lord, and quite a bit of my book is written as I’ve heard from the Lord I put the concepts and all in my book.  So I know Sid when this, when I’m hearing from the Lord this certain way.  The Lord wakes me up about 3:00 in the morning and it’s always dark instantly I’m wide awake, then I hear His voice.  And yeah, I never ever talk back, I just listen and it’s things to put in the book, things I go research, things like that, scriptures, He’ll give me scriptures.

Sid:  So this is the first time that you’ve had such a prophetic warning in your life.

John:  Like this, yeah.

Sid:  Have you had a prophetic warning previously that has come to pass?

John:  I was warned at 9/11, but I didn’t know it was just a general, it was just…This is the first time Sid that it was specific like this.  The Lord spoke to me, in fact I called you urgently didn’t I Sid as a result in hearing this from the Lord.  The Lord spoke to me and said, “I have broken the back of America.” It was crystal clear Sid, it was, in fact I heard it, it was several times I’ve broken the back of America, I have broken the back of America.”  It was repeated several times and I said…and Sid, in all the years that I’ve heard from the Lord, it’s the first time if you want to, if I could use the expression, I talked back, normally I just listen.  I said, “Why Lord?”  And I heard clear as a bell, homosexuality and Jerusalem.  And then I heard the next judgment will be for abortion.

Sid:  And God says the next judgment will be for abortion, I don’t want you to add or subtract from God’s words, but based on history what does that mean to you?

John:  Sid, I say this with, I don’t even know how I can say it Sid, this is one of the hardest things I think I’ve ever said in our interviews, but Sid it’s crystal clear from the Book of Numbers that if you shed innocent blood it takes the blood of those of those that shed it to pay for it.  And Sid we’ve killed 50 million babies in America Sid, legally, 50 million.  And I believe Sid and there was no date given to me, there was nothing that I think I could say “Well, it’s final it must happen, but if there isn’t a rise in America Sid of the church, and if I say playing religious games, that’s my terminology for not facing reality on what’s going on with the Lord. Not facing this continual slaughter of children in the womb, not facing the dividing Jerusalem, not facing the homosexual agenda that we’re marrying homosexuals now legally in our nation.

Sid:  Now what they say is they call it same sex union, they don’t call it marriage and they are justifying it that way by playing with semantics and words.

John:  Well, the effect with the Lord is that it’s the same you know.  Sid I feel that there is horrific judgment coming to America and untold numbers of Americans can perish Sid.  And what you said Sid on a previous show about the economic changes in America, if me and you had discussed that let’s say in 2007 that Bear Stearns was going to be gone, that Leman Brothers had failed and that Merrill Lynch was going to fail that in effect, how do you explain what the Federal Government if doing?  Aren’t we like socializing the economy?

Sid:  We’re putting a band aids on is what I see it because trying to avoid the inevitable unless as you said and I’m going to repeat, “Unless there is a major repentance and a turning towards God it looks like we’re on borrowed time.

John:  Yes Sid, that’s what it takes; it takes the Church to cry out and stop playing religious games Sid.  Listen to Numbers 35:33 “So you should not pollute the land wherein you are for blood it defiles the land and the land cannot be cleansed of the blood that is shed there in but by the blood of Him that shed it.

Sid:  Sobering thoughts, sobering words…

Sid:  I have a guest that I should not be talking to right now; he should have been dead many times.  And I find that when there’s such a diabolical plot to destroy someone it’s almost as if the devil has some inside knowledge that there’s something powerful that this person is going to bring forth in the Kingdom.  I mean Dr. Jim Richards your stepfather tried to murder you, your natural Father tried to murder you, they shipped you off to your grandmother, I guess to save your life and she was crazy too.  You got involved in drugs and alcohol, you were a rock musician. How in the world did you reverse that lifestyle?  And in addition to all of that you had kidney disease and you had a number of diseases from that horrible lifestyle and everything else!  How did you survive?

Jim:  You know I can look back and I can only assume that somehow God protected me from so many horrible opportunities to die you know.  I went through a lot of pain, a lot of physical pain, and I went through a lot of emotional pain. You know deep inside me there was this hunger to know God.  And as long as I can remember even though I lived this horrible lifestyle, even though you know as a teenager …

Sid:  But where did this come from?  How in the world with the lifestyle you were living did you have this hunger to know God?

Jim:  You know my personal belief is that God calls to every heart that maybe every heart doesn’t listen or every heart doesn’t respond, but I believe God calls to every heart.  You know I’ve looked back over my life and the only time that I can remember having any involvement with church was when I was a child. At Christmas one year my mother, something happened and I don’t remember if my Dad beat her up, I really don’t remember, but she ended up in the hospital at Christmas and the church brought us some food.  So when my Mom got out of the hospital we went to church for just a few weeks.  I remember actually then maybe, at four years old or five years old, one night as a service was ending and the pastor walked outside to go to his car I remember chasing him down the sidewalk, grabbing him by his coat and trying to stop him and tell him that I wanted to know God.  And he turned to me and said, “Well, you are too young.” So that kind of shot down any you know, all of my hopes at that moment, but I always wanted to know God.  Even when I was using drugs, dealing drugs, I think that every night every single night when I went to sleep if I was sober enough to do so I would just pray, and I would say, “God don’t let me die like this, I want to know you and I don’t want to die like this.”

Sid:  Just out of curiosity as a Rock Musician I can just image long hair.

Jim:  Oh yeah.

Sid:  And the way you looked when you walked into church were you accepted at all?

Jim:  No, not really and this was in the late ‘60s and early ‘70s. Actually by this time about 1969 I think it was I actually started going to churches and would go to their office during the week and knock on the door and ask to see the Pastor, sometimes they wouldn’t allow me to.  Sometimes I would get in to see the Pastor, and I would go in and say listen “My name is Jim Richards, I live here in Hinesville, I’m a drug dealer, I’m messed up, I’m on drugs, I think I’m dying,” because by this time my kidney disease with substance abuse had just really taken its toll on my body.  I woke up every morning with pretty much with blood on my pillow you know, my skin had this disease, my hair was falling out, I would just tell these guys “Look I’m trying to find God, I’m going to Hell, I know it and I want to find God.”  And the amazing thing was nobody told me how to get saved!  I had people tell me your right you are going to Hell and then on the other end of the spectrum I had people tell me “Don’t worry nobody’s going to Hell.”  And of course I thought they were all crazy, I just wanted to know God because I knew that I needed to get delivered from me!

Sid:  But, “Well Jim, give me a bottom line what crossed you over to the point where you can say now I know that I know God?”

Jim:  You know during this period of time I was driving to another city to try out a new drummer. I was putting together a new band, and the guy that was with me was my bass player and his cousin used to help us get drugs in from Atlanta so that we could sell and use drugs here.  And his cousin had gotten saved and of course we didn’t know the terms save, we just said, “He got religion.”  His name was Ernie, and so I asked my friend about getting some drugs from Ernie and he said, “Man,” and he said “Ernie he’s got blank, blank religion and he is blank and telling me about Jesus and he’s blank and telling me about for God and you’re blank against God.”  And he’s just cussing and ranting and raving, but in the process of his ranting and raving I heard enough of the gospel that for the first time in my life I knew that I had to believe on Jesus, that He died for me and that God raised Him from the dead.  I didn’t understand what that meant really in any great degree. So I let him out of the car when we finished out little road trip and I’m driving down the road and I just said, “God I don’t get this, I don’t understand this but if I got to believe on this thing about Jesus dying for me I’m willing to believe that and I’ll give You my life if You want my life.”  My salvation prayer was one of these prayers where I said, “And here’s the deal, I’m not going to play church and I’m not going to believe anything about you that I don’t read in the Bible for myself so if You’ll get a Bible in my hands and if you will take my life I will give you my life.”  And all I can say is that in that moment I had a revelation of the love of God where it seemed like I left my body for an eternity and experienced something that was completely beyond words.  And what was interesting I was crossing a set of railroad tracks there were about six or eight railroad tracks there and by the time I reached the other side of the railroad tracks I had come back from what seemed like an eternity.  And all I knew was at that moment that God loved me and that I was a new man.

Sid:  Where did the passion come for understanding healing?  You know this, I can go to almost any good church in America, I mean that believes in healing, that preaching healing and say “Everyone that is sick if you’ll stand up you’ll get healed.”  And 90% of the people will stand up.  You have a passion to understand why they’re not healed.

Jim:  Right.

Sid:  Why do you have such a passion?

Jim:  Well you know first of all I was born with a congenital kidney disease which I really should not have even survived the first year of my life.  And because of that I had a lot of immune disorders that made me very vulnerable to different diseases. So throughout my young life you know I had spinal meningitis, I had swine flu.  I had you just almost name it; plus I had life threatening kidney infections on a fairly regular basis so first of all the experience of living through that kid of physical pain you know drove me to great compassion for people.  I have been involved in all kinds of ministry you know, I have conducted meetings all over the world, I seen every miracle in the New Testament most of them I’ve seen hundreds of times.  But I still have great compassion for those people that are trapped somewhere that they don’t get healed in a meeting and so many times we just right that off to okay, they just don’t have enough faith or whatever, but God loves those people, Jesus died for those people and the Bible gives us some very serious…

Sid:  You know my heart goes out to someone that says “I believe that God heals, I’ve seen lots of people healed, but why doesn’t God heal me?”  And that is the silent prayer of so many Christians today and I believe you have answers.

Jim:  Well, you know that’s what I set out to find, you know I still lay hands on people, I still believe for the miraculous, I still experience the miraculous, but for that person that is standing there saying “Why am I not getting healed?”  I want to be able to go to some very real Biblical answers, and I want to be able to help that person walk through a Bible process so that they can put off. You know the Bible says to put off anything related to our old man.  And that’s not just the old man in sense of all the wicked things we have done, it’s our sense of identity, any aspect of believing about ourselves that is not based on who we are in Jesus. The Bible tells us to put that off and to put on this new identity that we have in Christ, put on Jesus really.  I have discovered that you can’t help a person put on what we have in Jesus if there’s something from their past, maybe a hurt, maybe a pain, maybe a shame, if they are holding on to that they cannot put on healing or even happiness sometimes because they’re holding on to something that they need to let go of.

Sid:  Well, you go pretty deep in your teaching, you talk about trapped feelings, trapped emotions, trapped wrong thinking, and you teach people how to identify it and get rid of it in an amazing simplistic fashion, and I do say simplistic!

Jim:  It is very simplistic!

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here with LaDonna Taylor. And during the break we were talking about ears. I wish you had ears to hear what she was telling me. But you’ve actually prayed for people that the bones weren’t there.

LaDONNA: That’s right.

SID: And God has given them hearing. Tell me what goes on with people.

LaDONNA: Well most of the time they’re just so surprised. I’ve gotten to the point where I just think God can do anything.

SID: Are you telling me they’re not saying, I came here tonight believing I’d get my hearing.

LaDONNA: That’s right. Some of them, one lady that was born deaf didn’t even understand why I was playing the violin, and she just went to church because there wasn’t anything else to do. She was deaf. Her life was extremely limited. And she went, and she almost didn’t come to the altar when the person that was signing said, “Take your hearing aids out and go to the altar.” But she did, and she’s healed today.

SID: Now you’ve had the privilege, and I mean a high privilege of hearing the music of Heaven. What is it like, LaDonna, the music of Heaven? It’s got to be out of this world. I couldn’t resist it.

LaDONNA: How can I tell you with words, with a human voice what that music could sound like? I could say to you, it has many, many, many more notes than we’re used to hearing. The voices sounded like thousands or maybe millions of voices behind it. But it’s unmistakable. You knew you were hearing something supernatural.

SID: You see angels’ wings, Jesus right by someone, healing them as you’re playing.

LaDONNA: Yes.

SID: Tell me what angels’ wings look like. I don’t even know.

LaDONNA: What I saw was clear, transparent, pearlescent and very beautiful, like you see a dove’s white beautiful wings. That’s what I saw.

SID: You proclaim that people are going to be healed before it happens. I do that, too. And I have noticed that God honors it every time. Now sometimes I proclaim it, and I’m not in a friendly environment. And if God doesn’t show up, I’m in big trouble.

LaDONNA: Jesus loves for us to believe his word. And that’s what we’re doing.

SID: If I ask you to play your violin, which is right there, right now, what’s going to happen? I want you to proclaim and then play that violin.

LaDONNA: I know exactly what He’s going to do.

SID: Okay.

LaDONNA: There are people, you need to be healed of a broken heart because there’s something you’ve forgotten. Maybe some of you never knew it, but I’m going to let the notes speak to you.

[violin music]

LaDONNA: He loves you. He loves you. Don’t ever forget it.

SID: LaDonna, people are healed, which is so amazing to me, of not just something they got yesterday, but long term diseases when you play the violin. Tell me about one person.

LaDONNA: I remember a service where a gentleman waited until the end of the service. At the very end we were ready to dismiss and he came up. The presence of God got so strong when he got close, and he started crying, and he said, “I’ve had fibromyalgia for 23 years. I’ve been in constant pain for 23 years.” Instantly, Jesus took it away.

SID: There’s a song that I love, “All Creatures of Our God and King”. Tell me something that happened when you played this song.

LaDONNA: This music, to me, is the closest to the sounds of Heaven that I’ve heard.

SID: I can’t wait to hear that. Would you get to the music set right now. And I want you to hear some of the music of Heaven.

Sid:  I am so excited about our guests Ron and Glenda Pettey.  I’m speaking to them by way of telephone at their home just outside of Houston, Texas.  I have just finished reading their book “Heaven is Real.”  And I can tell you this book has the atmosphere of heaven when it’s being read.  Ron and Glenda was it love at first sight on your blind date?

Ron:  Yes, it was.

Glenda:  Actually love at second sight, the first few hours I led him to the Lord, and then after that he looked pretty good.

Sid:  Now, just out of curiosity had you led many people to the Lord before you led your blind date to the Lord?

Glenda:  No, I’m sorry to say I was a cradle Baptist. So I had no excuse for that, but the Lord just put the words in my mouth and it all came out, and Ron was ready to receive, he was so ready.

Sid:  And Ron had a physical condition called Hydrocephalus, what is that exactly Glenda?

Glenda:  Okay that is just weird, spinal fluid was not draining properly through the ventricles in the center of his brain, he had had a blow to the head some years earlier in Vietnam. It was years later that this condition really surfaced.  And they had the doctors had to put in a shunt, I call it the little plumbing to reroute that spinal fluid.

Sid:  And I understand that every once and awhile that shunt would get out of place and what would happen?

Glenda:  Right it would clog, it would malfunction, many emergency runs into surgery a number of times. Then in 1982 the shunt developed into infection and had to be replaced.  Then in the replacement process we found out many many hours later they had inadvertently placed the new tubing right into a massive blood clot that had not shown up on X-ray.

Sid:  So if it was in the blood clot that means that the spinal fluid could not get out the brain so I would imagine his bead would swell up.

Glenda:   It was very swollen, swollen really beyond recognition.  So the doctors were rushed back in on a Sunday morning to find him in this condition because the blood clot would not be known for many hours yet.  So they were doing emergency surgery to go back in on a Sunday morning.  I called friends from across the state, realizing that they would be up on Sunday getting ready to go to church so that many could be praying for Ron.

Sid:  And he literally had this emergency surgery and he died on the operating table. He had an experience of going to heaven.  But it wasn’t quite what most people would think because when he got to heaven they said his name was not on the scroll.  And Ron is going to be sharing a lot about that this week, but Glenda you told me that Ron gets really emotional about it and he can’t even get the words out, explain.

Glenda: He does, he relives this testimony this experience every time we share it, we have shared this hundreds of times over the years.  But still every time he’s just there again, it’s reliving the experience.

Sid:  So you jump in because he’s reliving it he gets so emotional.  Well Ron, when you died tell me the first thing you remember seeing.

Ron:  I remember I knew where I was and I walked up to this table and I’m going to call it a table because I have no better words where I walked up to it and on this table was a book.  I walked up and I said, “I’m ready to go in.”  And this person looked at the book and my name is not there. I became just really frustrated because I’d accepted the Lord Jesus as my Lord and Savior and my name was suppose to be in that book.  Why isn’t my name in that book?  Well, by this time a person had come out of heaven, now I’m not in heaven and I in sort of a foyer area.  A man comes out of heaven, walks over to the person at the table and as I explained to him and he says “I’ll go in and check.”  Now he goes in to heaven, actual heaven I’m sort of in the foyer area and he goes into heaven and comes out a little bit later…

Glenda: He comes over to Ron and he says, he actually has a report from there.

Ron:  He says, it’s not your time you’re being sent back and I’m going with you.  Now this turned out to be my guardian angel.  See I met my guardian angel face to face in fact he came back with me, stayed in the hospital room for several days, a week.  I tried to introduce him to everybody that came to visit me in the hospital.  And they all dismissed it as well maybe he’s had brain surgery and so…

Sid:  Well, Glenda what did you think when he said, “I want to introduce you to this gentleman in my room?”

Glenda:  Right we horrified, we felt like he was hallucinating he had finally recovered from the surgery and then was trying to introduce us.  And of course this is in intensive care so every four hours we had ten minutes that he’s trying to introduce us again.  And finally we would go back out and pray that “Please Lord, let his brain clear,” and finally we’d walk in and he was not doing that anymore.

Sid:  But actually you had quite a report from the doctor that although it was a miracle he came back to life for ten years he had amnesia except for one thing; what was the one that he didn’t have amnesia over?

Glenda:  Of course, all his heaven experience, all of heaven and all of scripture and all of who Jesus is, was in his heart.  And we call that really his heavenly memory rather than his physical memory; so he had memory of all of heaven.

Sid:  Okay, Ron when they said your name wasn’t on the list what did you say?

Ron:  I thought they were bottom line I thought that they were crazy. Because I knew I had done everything necessary to get into heaven. When they finally convinced me that my name wasn’t there I raised such a ruckus that another gentleman came out of heaven walked over to the table to explain to him what is happening and he says “I’ll go in heaven and check.”  Now, I’m not in heaven at this point.

Glenda:   Right. At the very end when the second fellow came back he came over to Ron and he said, “It’s not yet your time, your mission’s not yet complete and you’re being sent back.”  At that point Ron had the most unusual response, he said, “I want to see my wife.”

Ron:  I didn’t even know that I was married because I had no memory.

Glenda:  He wanted to give him a request, but he felt like they couldn’t fulfill and they would have to say “Okay you’ve got us there come on into heaven.”  But instead the angel just nodded and said, “Okay that can be arranged.”

Ron:  The first person I remember seeing after regaining consciousness is Glenda, and my guardian angel was right there with me he pointed here she is.  And I thought wow, thank you Lord you picked out a good one for me.

Sid:  Okay, your ploy did not work. So there still not letting you into heaven, but they also said Glenda that it was because people were praying, explain.

Glenda:  Oh yes, that Sunday morning that I got the call from the doctor at 6:00 AM. The Lord had prepared for this so it was very calm to me.  I rushed down to the hospital and very soon after that I found phones I could call long distance with. So I called several people around the state who I knew would be getting up to go to church that morning.  So I knew that there would be people praying, then we just waited.  We waited for many, many hours until in the afternoon hours before we had a report, but I knew people were praying.  So then as soon as Ron recovered from this, then he told me how he had heard noise in heaven and asked, “What is all this noise?”

Ron:  At this point the angel said, “This is not noise, these are all intercessory prayers coming up on your behalf.  I said in disbelief, “You got to be kidding me.”  He said, “No, would you like to hear one?”  I said, “Yeah, I want to hear one,” you know because I wanted to get in heaven, I didn’t what these prayers interfering with me getting into heaven.” So one of the prayers was drawn out, above all the rest, he’s a dear friend of ours in Port Lavaca, Texas.  I heard every word he prayed, he was praying at the pulpit, he was a deacon of the week, or something like that and I quoted his prayer word for word.

Sid:  Here’s the deal, when he got back they had taped that prayer and you quoted it word for word before you heard the tape.  I mean this is the most phenomenal evidence of the authenticity of this experience.

Ron:  That’s exactly what I did. I tell you when I heard the tape, you know soon after getting out of the hospital we drove to Port Lavaca and they had just started recording their messages on tape.  And he found a tape and when we came back to report to Glenda and the rest of the family we had chill bumps on our arms both times the signs of God falls because it was just unbelievable.

Sid:  I’ll tell you what’s unbelievable to me, oh no it’s actually believable is that same presence you sense on this interview right now, it’s the atmosphere of heaven.