Sid Roth

Sid: Sid Roth here with Michelle Gold and Michelle I mean everything is going your way a top star and tragedy strikes what happened?

Michelle: Oh my gosh! I was at Manhattan School of Music studying opera and my… I was in this singing group actually and a band that played Bamitzahs and weddings. And it seemed like I was on top of the world making some good money too to support my college career; my voice just completely disappeared it was down to a whisper I was brought into the principal’s office and ashamed asked to remove myself from the school for the entire semester and to undergo voice therapy. Now they thought it was a nodule so I started spending thousands of dollars on voice therapy which was supposed to remove it. Between that time that that has happening also lost a friendship with a boy that I thought I was in love with and thought this is horrible I’m losing my relationships with my friends and my voice. I’m realizing my voice is like a god to me this is very unhealthy and dysfunctional.

Sid: Michelle loses her voice, she loses her god, her god was her voice. She’s doing these vocal lessons exercises she got into a 12 step program for people with an abusive background what happened?

Michelle: So my voice was completely gone and I was completely down and again thought of taking my life out of my hands and I had absolutely no purpose for my plan except that maybe I’d turn to God. So I found myself going to a 12 step program called Alanon. And at that program one of the steps is to find your higher power. I know who He is and it’s clear that the answer to all of your loneness and your emptiness and the answer to your purpose in life is finding your God. And I thought that’s it that’s what I’ve been trying to do all of this time maybe it’s Yeshua! And so I decided to read for myself, think for myself and go get a New Testament again. I think I found my New Testament actually it was my dirty garage somewhere hidden under the tool bench. My father had hidden it and Sid I actually found the Bible. Started reading for myself where it said “I’m the way, the truth and the life.” And it was so clear to me and I ended up in this Italian Pentecostal Church in Brooklyn New York.

Sid: And the next time you go to that church because you like this Youth Pastor Joe.

Michelle: Ah.

Sid: I know about that. The next time you go you find out about being baptized in the Holy Spirit what was that like for you?

Michelle: Wow! Well yeah at this one particular meeting this woman was praying in her prayer language and I began to shake and quiver it was the most beautiful experience of a lifetime. I was completely healed in a moment of all impurity Sid it was amazing nothing I had ever felt in my entire life with all the music that might have given me goose bumps there was nothing like it. I began to get the interpretation of is exactly what she saying and it was all about God healing me at that moment from my need to fill myself up with anything but Him. And He was going to satisfy me and you know like the Bible says in Psalms 145 that “He shall open His hand and satisfy the desire of every living thing.” I was completely healed on the spot of all of that pain and shame it was beautiful.

Sid: But the best part is they finally figure out what’s wrong with you that why you lost your voice because what you told me it started to deteriorating at a young age until gradually to the point you lost your voice. The found out at you had a cyst and I’m reminded of Julie Andrews the same type of thing happened to her she was never able to sing and she didn’t speak correctly again.

Michelle: Ah I know.

Sid: When she had…

Michelle: I just read a scripture about the woman who had the issue of blood and for years and years she waited for a healing. I was waiting for that healing I really was. I bumped into Joy Williams on the elevator at a gospel music convention actually and I had one minute to talk to her from floor 5 to floor 1 and I said “Joy what should I do I’m losing my voice?” And she said “You got to go to Dr. Cleveland or got to go to National Clinic at Vanderbilt they’re going to help you.” And that was it she got off and I went. They actually found out I was missed diagnosed that it was not a nodule that could be healed with therapy that it was actually a cyst that needed to be removed immediately.

Sid: Okay they remove the cyst but is there any danger with this surgery?

Michelle: Oh my gosh there is like you know people have lost their voice completely from the surgery there is no guarantee. In fact, I went to the studio and was able to share with a friend of mine and I said let me just sing a couple of licks because this could be it this could be end of my voice forever! And I remembering singing in that studio like maybe it was the last time that I was ever to sing. My dad used to warn me “Michelle your voice is so forceful all the time you’ll never going to sing on Broadway, or you’re never going to sing on tour how are you going to do it?” Even though he loved me and he believe in me he just didn’t want me to get my hopes up.

Sid: Okay your on fire for the Lord, your Spirit-filled you’re telling everyone that breathes about Yeshua you have this surgery.

Michelle: Oh my gosh.

Sid: And what happened? You found out that God preformed a miracle, not only was it successful what happened to your voice?

Michelle: Well I forgot to tell you that before every concert people used to gather around me and like 50 people and pray that my voice would come back for a concert to be able to sing and minister. And then after I got the platform it would be completely gone. (Laughing) So after the surgery it completely got 8 notes higher my voice therapist, an Israeli woman, a very beautiful woman, she was startled, she was amazed, she was stunned. She said Michelle I’ve never seen this we’re not going to voice therapy we’re going to do singing lessons, get your songs out. And I started getting out my songs and I get out “You Were There” and she sings “Michelle Jesus was not there at the beginning he was not there there.” And I’m like “Yes He was” you know. I started telling her in the lessons it was great we didn’t have to do any voice therapy at all it was completely healed.

Sid: Well I want to hear that range right now tell me about the song “Dying to be Heard.”

Michelle: Oh yeah “Dying to be Heard” is about the lost and the dying in society. My friend Elise Merritt our parents met in a pool complaining about us that we both believed in Jesus they’re Jewish girls and we both lived half way across the United States from each other. But they were complaining about us and they got us connected and we became best friends over email and we wrote this song together for her film. She is a… she makes beautiful Messianic films for the Lord. And we were able to write this song about the lost people in the Holocaust and the unborn believe it or not and the autistic. The unloved and uncared for in the society to give them a voice so this is what this is about. And you know for me personally Sid I was so dying to be heard before I found Yeshua; I’m no longer dying to be heard. The Lord died for me you know and I never felt so heard in my whole life.

Sid: Let’s hear “Dying to be Heard.”

Sid: My guest by way of telephone is Dave Roberson I’m speaking to him at his head quarters at Tulsa, Oklahoma. On yesterday’s broadcast we found out about the supernatural call that he received on his life for full time ministry. So he quits his job and he says “I’ll just put 8 hours in a day of prayer.” However you know he knew about praying in tongues but he didn’t know much about it and it’s pretty hard to occupy 8 hours praying 5 days a week. And so how did you transition to the point to where you were praying in tongues the whole 8 hours?

Dave: It was hard Sid not knowing what to do with myself after the visions I had that we talked about yesterday. I didn’t know what to do with myself so I thought well I’ll just report down to this 8 x 8 prayer closet down at the church. I just put in the same amount of time that I’d have worked at the mill. So I never will forget those first mornings that I reported in. I took a real holy stand you know I fell on my knees and I’m going to pray in tongues you know. Well at first the tongues that I ended up praying and I didn’t know the importance of it or anything. And the only way that I really knew how to pray was English so I’d pray and then I’d get over into English and it wasn’t 15 minutes that I exhausted every English prayer I could think of I was praying for missionaries, I was praying for counties, I was praying for anything our cupboards anything I could think of to be full and I was afraid. And anyway after running after running out of everything I could think of in English I’d switch over to praying in tongues. After a while you know I remember those guys teaching “You just can’t pray in tongues any time you want to.” That would flag me for awhile and I’m thinking what option I’m going to do? So I begin to pray in tongues and pray in tongues and it seemed like minutes turned into hours and I kept checking my watch and finally I’d remember I’d take and break at 10:00 at the mill and I’d be thinking that it’d be legal to take a 15 minute break at 10:00. So I’d hurry and I’d run off and have a cup of coffee because I had to be back and I’d start in again on my knees praying “Oh God remember the missionaries and it’d last 15 minutes again so just to survive the time I’d begin to pray in tongues again. Sid I had no idea what that was doing for me. I had no idea it was beginning to sequence it, it changed my life and 30 years later now.

Sid: Well, you just described yesterday what happened in Brazil would have never happened.

Dave: No.

Sid: If it wasn’t for that foundation that you put within yourself. Most people that accept praying in tongues is for today they don’t have a clue what they’re accomplishing. Tell me in your book you have so many insights in this arena that very few Christians. I think that any Christian that reads your book would be forced to pray in tongues at least an hour a day. Like I explained on yesterday’s broadcast about this young man whose whole destiny was changed just as yours was by praying in tongues. How does this affect our destiny?

Dave: Sid when you was talking about the young man how this young man thought that he was called to be a businessman and wanted to come in and pray and pray and he’d got a hold of our tapes and he got a hold of our tapes and found out what I did and made his mind up to do the same thing. Well as I continued to pray in tongues the first thing I found out about it was that it encompassed it it said “He that speaks in this unknown tongues speaks mysteries.” The mysteries you’re speaking in prayer not unto man l Corinthians 14 but unto God. It says “How be it in the Spirit this man is speaking mysteries?” Well the mysteries we’re speaking everything that the mystery that Christ is in you, into you, and through you the hope of glory. And praying in tongues is like any other kind of prayer Sid it’s designed by God to be answered. When I pray the mountain moving prayer of faith and it manifests in the mountain goes my senses can report to me that the prayer of faith has been answered. Or the prayer of consecration I’ll go anywhere and be anything you want me to be I’ll open my eyes and God will answer a prayer like that so fast you’re likely to find yourself in Africa or something. But praying in tongues is like any other form of prayer it’s designed by God to be answered. Yet these mysteries that you’re praying the mystery of everything Christ is in you and to you and through you the hope of glory was designed by God to be answered. And the young man found out that he’s called to be an evangelist, and not only an evangelist a powerful miracle manifestation of glory in God’s presence in his meetings kind of evangelist. In Romans 8:26-27 and 28 it says “He that searches the heart,” the Holy Spirit, He knows what the whole plan and mind of God is for you and I and that He makes intercession for that plan according to the will of God. You cannot pray even one hour in tongues that the powerful that the mighty Holy Spirit who holds the whole plan of God for your personal life will not run out ahead of you. And this mystery and this prayer that you’re praying in tongues the Holy Spirit knows the whole plan of God for your life and he supernaturally will begin to lay it out ahead of you. For if you will not stop praying even that one hour a day it if need be it will produce the other hours that you’ll need to pray. If you will not stop praying then His plan will be worked and just like the gentleman that you told me about if he found his way into God’s perfect plan for his life. You and I wouldn’t have chosen him for that he didn’t seem to qualify. I wouldn’t…

Sid: I’ll tell you Kathryn Kuhlman type of thing (The least likely). Laughing

Dave: I know the feeling I wouldn’t have called myself or chose myself. You know but this man supernaturally because it’s the Holy Spirit who knows the Father’s whole plan for his life is to the one that is choosing the words; the one that’s creating the prayer on the inside of your spirit. He’s the one that is laying a prayer out ahead of you that has no error in it. And if there’s one prayer that God is ever free to answer it will be that one Sid and that’s what happened to your young friend.

Sid: And not only that I have to believe that you know “Without faith you can’t please God.” And in most prayers you need a certain degree of faith to believe that God is going to answer it but when you’re praying in unknown tongues I don’t think that you need any faith at all.

Dave: The only faith you need is the one that was enough for you to go into the closet and utter it (Chuckling). That’s all the faith you need I call it mustard seed just enough.

Sid: Now you had been praying in tongues for a while and you went to a church meeting and you had a vision like an x-ray of someone’s hip was that the first time something like this had happened to you?

Dave: It was.

Sid: Well tell me about that.

Dave: A woman caught on to what I was doing and she knocked on the door and said “Are you feeling any difference?” And I told her “Oh yeah the only thing I’m really feeling is a dry chin and a dry throat.” And she said “Well, I’ve got to go.” Well, she belonged to a church that really didn’t believe in speaking with tongues and things. So she came back a month or so later and she said “Could you go with me to a lay witness?” And I said “What’s that?” She said “Our church’s meeting of statewide at our building and we’re having a lay witness where we teach and testify and we’re having it at a home this morning will you come?” And I’m thinking “Oh yeah” I love any legal reason excuse I wasn’t feeling anything or edification or nothing I didn’t know how it worked.” So I said “Oh yeah” I ran home and changed and knocked on the door. And I didn’t I was a little late because I had to go change and so I didn’t know the woman who was setting next to me or whom they set me next to that had come in on a crutch. And so Sid you know I was just… I was so happy to be with people you know I’d been locked away for about 3 months.

Sid: I know the feeling.

Dave: (Laughing) I was just so happy going “There’s real people around me I get to hear a real teacher.” So they brought me I believe a cup of tea or something. And I was setting there and so he began and since then I’ve affectionately named him the golden tongue orator you know because he began speaking. He says “And we know that God is the great celestial between the trouble waters of mankind.” And I’m going “Oh, what did I get myself into?” I’m shaking, my tea watching the tea grounds just for excitement you know this was horrible. Out of sheer boredom I turned around and looked at the elderly lady next to me and suddenly it looked like an x-ray was put up between me and her it was so vivid Sid that I looked around even to see if anybody else could see it I didn’t know what was going on. And so finally finally I leaned over to her and I said “Mam do you have trouble in your right hip?” She says “Well young man that’s what the doctor tells me” Because it was an x-ray of a deteriorated hip socket where the deterioration reached at least 4 inches down into the leg bone. She says “That’s what the doctor tells me.” And I yelled “Glory to God!” she says “I beg your pardon young man.” I says “Oh, I don’t mean that you’re sick I meant that God wants to heal you!” And she says “He does?” And I says “Yes can I pray for you?” And to her prayer meant “In the course of your day would you bow your head and remember me” but to me it meant the Pentecostal hardest prayer I could muster. And when she said yes I jumped around in front of her got on my knees grabbed her by the ankles and pulled both of her legs up even with my stomach while she was on the chair and I was on my knees. And Sid one of them was 3 or 4 inches shorter than the other I didn’t you know I didn’t do these things. I closed my eyes and prayed my hardest prayer. And I didn’t know it the first prayer her leg cracked and came out. I like to wrestle the poor lady off on the floor.

Sid: Listen after she was healed the silver tongued orator said “Lady, we don’t believe in miracles here.” And what did she say?

Dave: She grabbed her crutch and say “Well Sonny he healed me anyway.” And she was out…

Sid: Dave we’re out of time.

Sid: How is that everyone everywhere going to hear the good news?  I believe that if we follow the directions by the Manufacturer we will not go wrong. And I’m talking about God and I’m talking about the Bible. This is how I see it God is so clear that He always starts with the Jew to bless the world.  For instance, He started with the Jew when He went to Abram first so that there would be a blessing for the whole world.  Do you remember when Paul said in Roman’s 1:16 “I’m not ashamed of the gospel because the gospel is the power of God unto salvation to everyone who believes to the Jew first.” So we know God started with the Jew, we know Paul started with the Jew.  How about the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, who was speaking in unknown tongues at Shavuot, that’s the Hebrew for Pentecost? It was to the Jew first. So we have God going to the Jew first, we have Abraham going to the Jew first, we have the Holy Spirit going to the Jew first. How about Jesus?  Jesus said “I go only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” All of these were God’s strategizing and showing us His supernatural method of evangelizing by going to the Jew first it reaches the world.

I believe that we are right on I mean it’s so close I could almost taste it a major outpouring of God’s Spirit. God’s going to have mercy on planet earth because unfortunately I see a lot of problems.  The Bible says “Yet once more, I God, am going to shake this earth and those that are not on a firm foundation are going to fall.” And let’s face it the shaking has already begun on planet earth and it’s going to get increasingly worse. And only those on a firm foundation are going to stand and God wants to have mercy again on planet earth and He’s going to use the same strategy that He’s always used. What city did he start in?  What country did He start in?  What people group did He start with? Jerusalem, Israel, the Jewish people. I believe the next move of God’s Spirit is going to happen in Israel, in Jerusalem with the Jewish people. It will not be something through great apologetics and proof as to why Jesus is the Messiah. Oh no, no, no it will not be by man’s might nor by man’s power but it will be a move of God’s Spirit. And every certain number of years you can look out throughout history there were certain moves of God’s Spirit on Jewish people. And when God moves on Jewish people it opens up a supernatural door to reach all people.  And I tell you that move is about ready to happen if it hasn’t happened already.

Joy and I went to see a movie last week it’s called “The Kingst.”  And it’s about a Polish Jew and I guess I really relate to it because I am a Polish Jew. And my father was born in Poland and it’s got to do with the Holocaust and the Warsaw Ghetto and I have to tell you this movie made a greater impact on me than “Schindler’s List.” It showed and I recommend everyone go see this if possible or get the video when it’s out because it showed what I believe is a preview of the world turning anti-Semitic, anti-Jewish.  How could it happen?  Easy, I see a lot of presidential candidates and one previous that was a presidential candidate saying “The whole purpose of the Iraqi war was the Jews and Israel and they’re our problem.”

You see as the terrorism increases more and more people will pick up that line and when you see or read about what happened in the holocaust. I mean it’s unbelievable that humans can treat other humans as if they’re not even humans, as if they’re just vegetables and just kill them at random.  We see the devil recognizes the seed that God has always used and will continue to use will continue to be the Jew, and therefore if he can cause Jewish people to be murdered than there’s most likelihood of revival and more that will go to hell rather than go to heaven.  That’s so simple you need help to get confused.

Now I believe that I’ve now been a Jewish believer in the Messiah for over 30 years now and I believe that I am a classic Jew and that’s why God saved me, and that’s why God wants me to share my story with you because if you can understand me you can understand my people. Yes it is only going to be a move of God’s Spirit but you can get in the way. And as a matter of fact most people don’t know that Jewish people are open to the gospel right now because most Christians aren’t sharing with anyone and most Christians are so intimidated of Jewish people and most Christians don’t understand we’re praying and saying “God let’s have a release of your miracle anointing.” And I look on television and I see great evangelist saying “I know that we’re right on the peripheral of a great move of God’s Spirit, a great move of miracles where the average Christian is going to be able to pray and miracles will happen.”

Well God’s strategy to reach the world is to go to the Jew first and God’s method to reach the Jew has always been in the Bible it says “The Jew requires a sign.” So the reason that God is going to releasing these miracles is so the Jews will be saved to release a supernatural outpouring of God’s Spirit on Gentiles so that the greatest revival on planet earth is about ready to take place.  And the devil can’t stop it but he recognizes every Jew he can destroy now is one more going to hell and one less person that will be sold out red hot, modern day Paul the apostle, and one less person to release that great anointing for what the book of Ephesians calls the glorious church.

So this week I’m going to talk about how I came to the Lord. I was raised as I told you in a traditional Jewish family, my father was born in Poland, my mother was born in Rochester, New York.  And my father likes to share the story of my grandfather who my recollection of my grandfather is very very stern, very very religious Jew. And when my father would walk with my grandfather in Poland and walk by a church my Grandfather would spit. And so my father intuitively knew by being raised this way that there was something wrong with the church or with Christianity. He probably didn’t have a clue what was wrong, but unfortunately I studied what’s wrong and I’ll tell you if you study church history, if you study the “Quote fathers of the faith.” You will see a mixture of so much anti-Jewish, anti-Semitism, listen the Encyclopedia Judaic says “Short of the gas chambers, short of the ovens everything Hitler had to say about Jews came from church fathers.” So that’s why I could tell you about a few of my cousins I tried to witness to. One cousin in particular comes into mind and I would say to him “Listen those people that did those horrible things to our people were the opposite of Christians.” Jesus said “You’ll know my disciples by their love not by murdering Jewish people.” So there’s action spoke louder than their words they might have said they were Christians, but a Christian is a follower of the teaching of Jesus and Jesus was a Jew, Jesus is a Jew, Jesus loved the Jewish people. Jesus went to the Jew first.”  And he said “Stop it Sid! I’m going to tell you one thing and I’m going to make it real clear on the belt buckle on the Gestapo of the Nazis it said ‘In God we trust!’ So don’t tell me they weren’t Christians!” Then I tried to tell another cousin of mine about the love of Jesus; she’ll tell you the story about her two twins little babies a little baby boy and little baby girl.  And the Nazis came into their second story apartment grabbed the little boy out of the mother’s arms and throws the baby out the window.  Now you try and tell that particular cousin of mine about the love of Jesus.

The one behind all of this is the devil himself because the only people group that are equipped that are called to share the gospel with Jewish people are Christians. Roman’s 11:11 says “Salvation has come to the Gentile to provoke the Jew to jealousy.” So some people say “Oh God what is my calling?” And God says “Why are you asking me what your calling is when you won’t do what I put in writing?” Roman’s 11:11 “Salvation has come to the Gentile to provoke the Jew to jealousy.” But that’s not the end that’s the catalyst because when the Jew is provoked to jealousy becomes a believer in Jesus it opens up a supernatural door of evangelism to all people. That’s the whole purpose of our ministry you know I can tell you the whole purpose of the Messianic Vision in one word souls.  What are you going to take to heaven with you your money, your houses, your families, your cars?  Nothing except one thing goes to heaven with you so you might as well make your life count you have one life make it count. It says in Proverbs “He who wins souls is wise.” Are you going to be wise? The strategy move in the supernatural (The Jew requires a sign) reach out to the Jew first, reach the Jew and open up a supernatural door of evangelism to all people.  Again so simple you need help to be confused.

But as I explained the devil has taken the one people group called by God the, Gentile Christians, to reach Jews and made us Jewish people who are seeing Gentile Christians as our enemy. So how in the world are Jewish people going to be reached? How in the world is revival going to happen? How is God going to do this?  Now my favorite scripture “It’s not by man’s might, nor by man’s power but it is by My Spirit sayeth the Lord.”  I want you to understand my people, I believe it’s not an accident you’re listening to this broadcast right now.

Sid:  This week I have been sharing my testimony. Why? Because we are on the edge of the greatest move of God’s Spirit in history that will start with the Jewish people, then spread to all people just as the first church started with the Jew and then spread to all people.  The greatest move of God’s Spirit for evangelism in the history of this earth; the greatest move of signs and wonders. Why? Again to reach the Jew, the Bible says “The Jew requires a sign.”

So boy was I messed up. As a matter of fact, I had people who read my testimony book and they say “Sid were you really this bad?” Some people don’t even like me after they read it. I felt I had a prophetic dream and God told me I must write my testimony book exactly the way it happened because I don’t have a problem with it because that person doesn’t live anymore; I’m a new creation, a new species, and if you didn’t know how bad I was then you couldn’t tell the difference. That’s why God had me write this, but more important He had me write this book so that you will understand the average American Jewish person you’re shortly going to bump into that is desperate to know Jesus. I tell you I proclaim that that average American Jewish person is desperate to know Jesus, but you don’t know this because you’re not opening your mouth and allowing God to fill it.

Well God is going to do a move of His Spirit on Jewish people but there are going to be asking questions and you must have good answers. This book has questions and answers but just by reading the story then give it to a Jewish person that God Himself is going to have cross your path.

On yesterday’s broadcast you found out that I was involved in the New Age and I was coming apart at the seams. Remember when I told you as a young kid I had this experience about death and it was so objectionable I blocked it from my mind? Well life was more difficult than that objectionable thing called death. I mean I reached my point, I go involved in this astral projection where your spirit leaves its body and you think this was… I was just going slightly nuts. Well, I was going just slightly nuts but it’s real. Duke University has a school of parapsychology, many colleges do. The Russians have been doing this for years.

I can tell you my spirit would leave my body and when this would happen this is the thought that I had. One I’ll go to sleep my spirit will leave my body and won’t make it back in time. If you’ve ever seen these Rod Serling science-fiction stories I have a plot that is so horrible you could put it together. Just in case there are young people listening I’m not going to explain it, but I had so much fear I was afraid to live, I was afraid to die.

My wife by the way was raised in a Christian home, they weren’t practicing at all they didn’t go to church. Their father was actually an atheist, her mother was a Christian. They shipped her off to church, they did not go themselves, but they shipped her off. This one day she walked down the aisle and became a believer in Jesus. When she got college she wasn’t prepared for her atheistic professors. She said “I wouldn’t become an atheist just in case there’s a God but I became an agnostic.”

When we got married I insisted that she convert to Judaism, she didn’t want to but I insisted. So she converted to Judaism. So you might say she was a Southern Baptist, agnostic, Orthodox Jew, she really was.

So worse day in my life I didn’t care whether I lived or died. I went out to a Jewish bookstore I bought a mezuzah, you see mezuzahs sometimes on Jewish doorposts they have scripture inside of them. I put it around my neck, I had a Bible at that time and I put it under my pillow. I was convinced I was involved with the devil himself, that I had opened myself up to the New Age. There was no where I could go for help, I couldn’t go to my parents who would give their life for me. They’d send me to psychiatrists one of the highest instances of suicide is among psychiatrists in this country. So they’re really going to help me? No! My problem was spiritual, it wasn’t mental or emotional, I had a demon inside of me and I need it out.

So by that point someone had given me a little booklet called the 4 Spiritual Laws, and I read these and I confessed my sins and I made Jesus my Lord, and nothing happened. So I didn’t even tell the guy that gave me the book, but I figured it didn’t work because in the New Age I had all sorts of feelings and experiences. But I had said that prayer then that night, the worst night of my life, I’m afraid my spirit’s going to leave my body and I’m going to be buried alive, awful thoughts going through my mind. So I said a 2 word prayer, but before I prayed that prayer I called my wife Joy. Remember I had been separated for a year, and I said “Joy it’s bad please pray for me.” She said “I will.”  I hung up, she hung up, I said a 2 word prayer “Jesus help.” That was it I went to sleep, I didn’t have a dream, had that in the New Age. I didn’t have a vision, had that in the New Age, and God has all of these things authentically in Christianity. He gave me something I never had in the New Age that fear that was encrusting me that was so tangible I could cut it with a knife. The phone would ring I could remember today even when it would ring I would just shake I was so nervous when the phone would ring.

I didn’t want to live, I didn’t want to die I was in awful shape, I just wanted out! I didn’t want Jesus but I was told that His power was greater than the power that I was involved in, and I was willing to try anything. Even coming from a Jewish Orthodox background and I said “Jesus help.”

I went to sleep that night not caring whether I lived or died and when I woke up in the morning, I tell you the evil within me was gone. As I was encrusted in fear, I was encased in liquid love. I had never felt such a feeling of peace in my entire life, and don’t ask me how I knew this but I knew that Jesus was responsible and I was very grateful. Then I heard the voice of God for the first time in my life that I knew it was God. He said “Return to your wife and daughter.” I returned and Joy and I celebrated our 39^th wedding anniversary. My daughter is married to a believer, she’s a believer. My father, my mother, my Jewish sister, my Jewish brother in law all believers. God is so good!

I’ll tell you something, I started reading the Bible for myself and I found such evidence, even that 18^th chapter of Deuteronomy that I read. It says in that same chapter, remember where it talks about the New Age is an abomination? It says in that same 18^th chapter the 18^th verse “The Lord said to me “What they have spoken is good.” Then God said “I will raise up for them a prophet like you,” He’s speaking to Moses. So there’ll be a prophet like Moses from among their brethren, which will be Jewish, “and I’m going to My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them all that I command Him. And it shall be that whoever will not hear My words, which He speaks in My name I will require it of him.” So this will be a greater prophet than Moses, that will be a Jew that will be God’s spokesman, but Moses was God’s spokesman. It will be almost like God’s word will be inside of Him. That’s what John was explaining. He said “The Word was with God, the Word was God, and the Word became flesh.” Then I read in Jeremiah 31:31 “Behold the day has come when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, not according to the covenant that I made with their forefathers which they violated, but under this covenant I will remember their sins no more. They shall know me and have intimacy with Me.”

Then I read the 53^rd chapter of Isaiah, I mean that was written 800 years before Jesus even came to earth. I read that same chapter to my Orthodox Jewish father who the last thing in the world would want to believe that Jesus was the Messiah. He said “You’re reading from a Christian Bible because you’re describing Jesus.” Then I read about His birth and His family and the Gentiles would follow Him, all in the Jewish scriptures. It is so clear you need help to get confused.

There are scales on the eyes of the Jewish people. I can just tell you my story and this was over 30 years ago. God restored my mind, He restored my health, He restored my marriage, He gave me what I was always looking for, He gave me intimacy with God. I know that there is a deeper intimacy, I know that there is a great Jewish wedding coming. I know that God is preparing His bride right now for that wedding, and I know that one of the catalysts for that wedding is intimacy with God. Another catalyst of that wedding is walking in signs and wonders, and the major catalyst for that wedding is for Gentile Christians to do what is written and not say “I want a flaky prophecy from a flaky prophet.” You’re not following the written words of the living God who says in Romans 11:11 “Salvation has come to the Gentile to provoke the Jew to jealousy.”

Your purpose is to reach Jewish people with the gospel, and somehow in reaching that Jewish person with the gospel it says “If it was a blessing the Jewish people rejected their Messiah, how much greater blessing when they receive their Messiah?” It’s going to cause life from the dead and the church will not become the institutional religious church that it has become today filled with as much tradition as we Jewish people have. It is going to be what the book of Ephesians calls “The glorious church” because it’s going to be so filled with the glory of God. When Jew and Gentile come together and that middle wall of separation comes down the Jew needs the Gentile Christian, the Gentile Christian needs the Jew. We are incomplete without each other, and in Him we become a new creation, that new creation has a name and His name is Jesus.  So simple you need help to get confused.

SID: Sid Roth here with Robbie Dawkins. And so Robbie, it blurts out of you before, you get, you had a mind bypass.

ROBBY: Yes.

SID: You say, “Your father is going to be healed and also his lungs are going to be healed.” And she hadn’t even mentioned lungs. After that came out of your mouth, what happened?

ROBBY: Well have you ever heard yourself say something, and as you’re hearing yourself saying it, you’re like, what did I just say? And I mean, I wanted with all my might, all my power to reach out and grab those words before it hit her ear and pull it back, and swallow it, destroying any evidence that I had uttered anything so stupid in my entire life. And so the first thing I said, “Now wait a minute.” I said, “You need to know something,” I said, “I’m no healer.” I said, “As a matter of fact, it’s probably a bad thing that I prayed for your dad because nobody I ever pray for gets healed.” And I said, “I don’t know what I’m talking about, you should not listen to a thing I say, because I absolutely, I have never prayed for anybody I have seen get healed.” And she says, “But you said God was going to give my dad a new heart.” I said, “Yes, but,” and she said, “Thank you,” and click, she hung up the phone. When I heard that phone click my heart dropped to my toes and I thought, oh dear God, this is some sort of, you know, exposé show on pastors who promise healing that actually kill people, and I just fell into the trap. I need to get my resume together. I’m going to get sued.

SID: Okay. A few days later, she calls you back. What happens?

ROBBY: It wasn’t even a few days. It was two hours later.

SID: Two hours?

ROBBY: She calls back and…

SID: [unintelligible] two hours now.

ROBBY: She was going into surgery right at that time.

SID: Oh I see.

ROBBY: So she calls back two hours later and all I hear on the other end is, [unintelligible], and she couldn’t talk, and I didn’t understand. And so I hung up on her. And then she calls back and she’s like, “Please don’t hang up this time.” And I said, and I recognized it was her, and I thought, oh dear God, I killed her dad. You know, I prayed for him, he’s dead. He probably would have at least survived a little bit. I’m serious, I was in panic. And I started immediately apologizing. I said, “I’m so sorry.” She said, “Sorry for what?” And I said, “Your dad died, right?” And she goes, “No, my dad didn’t die.” She goes, “That what I’m calling to tell you.” Now no one was more surprised to hear that than me. And she goes, “No.” She goes, “This is the thing.” She goes, “I just talked to the doctor.” And she goes, “When the doctor opened up my dad’s chest,” she said, “they couldn’t even find any scar tissue from the previous surgery except the scar on the outside of his chest on the skin.” She said, “Here’s the thing, he had a pig valve replacement of his valve and his heart, and the doctor said it was completely gone.” She said, “When they opened him up,” she said, “he had the heart—”

SID: The replacement was gone?

ROBBY: The replacement was gone.

SID: Wow.

ROBBY: He had a heart of a 30-year-old man, the doctor said.

SID: But then wait until you hear this next thing.

ROBBY: “My dad had a half lung removed because of lung cancer.” And she goes, “When they opened him up and checked, the doctor looked and said, ‘I believe this man has a whole lung.’ And they checked, and he did. He had a whole lung where he had half a lung removed.”

SID: So when this began, something began in Robbie and he has not been the same since. But the thing that intrigues me the most, Robbie, is I’ve seen pictures of this. You go out on the street, you talk to total non-believers and they say they feel something. They feel the presence of God. How did this start and can others do this?

ROBBY: Absolutely. I mean, anybody can do it. My, what I really believe is Jesus came to show us not what he could do as the Son of God, he was drawing a map of what we could do. He was coming as the second Adam to reinstate what the first Adam gave away. And so going out and just following what Jesus said. When Jesus said, “These things you will do and greater,” it’s an invitation to come and do the things Jesus did.

SID: That’s what happened in the first thing that happened with you after they got healed, they were all non-believers. What happened?

ROBBY: That next Sunday, she ended up coming to the church. I argued with her on the phone. I said, “I won’t believe it until I see a doctor’s report.” She goes, “Are you sure you’re a pastor?” And I said, “Yes, and I’m not a naïve pastor.” And she did. That next Sunday she brought a scroll of faxes, she brought a scrolled fax of the doctor’s report and it said everything I just shared with you. And I looked at it, I read it and I was blown away. And she brought her mother, her father who had been healed, her husband. They all ended up giving their lives to Christ as a result of that, every one of them.

SID: So let’s go back because I am so intrigued with the, it’s one thing for a believer to say, I feel the presence of God. It’s another thing for a non-believer to say, I feel. Tell me about this.

ROBBY: Well you know, what happens is that when God, God is in relentless pursuit of us. He’s pursing us. He’s passionate about us. We’re not begging him to come. He’s right here. He wants to come. And so when we pray for people they can feel it and we have the authority. Jesus said, “All authority has been given to me and I am in you.” And so all that authority that he has lives in you, and his power of source was the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit lives in you. We have all the ingredients living inside of us that was in him that did all the miracles. It’s right here. And so when we release we have the authority to release the manifest presence of God. Just like Jesus said, you know, “Peace I give to you.” Not just any peace, my peace. If somebody gives you something you can give it away. And so when we encounter and receive the presence of God we can give that away. We can release that. And so many times I would just pray for people, and I love especially people who just don’t believe at all, people who are atheists or don’t believe at all, to release to them the manifest presence of God so that they will feel the reality, the tangible presence of Jesus and realize that he’s real and that he’s in passionate pursuit of them. And they see it happen all the time.

SID: You know, it’s beyond that. And by the way, when he said see it happen all the time, he means that because the people where the presence of God is, all things are possible, all things. People are getting healed, coming to know Messiah. But he told me something when I was having a meal with him about he’s on a plane and there is a Jewish woman next to him, and if you thought it was a little funny, his first story, you will, you’re going to fall out of your seat even at home on this next story with this Jewish woman. We’ll be right back.

Sid: Oh I hope you heard the testimony yesterday of Gary Whetstone I mean Gary was an all American type kid everything going right in his life, a good athlete, a good student a freak auto accident he accident he can’t participate in sports anymore. He gets in with motorcycle gangs and drugs and gun dealing and gradually full of fear and hatred. And to make a long story short he literally went insane and his parents had to put him into a mental institution it was a mental institution for the criminally insane there was no hope so they wanted to do a procedure that is similar to a lobotomy. He’d end up having his mind reduced to a 3 year old permanently there was nothing else they could do. They’re ready to do the procedure a couple days before a stranger walks in and leads him to the Lord he has a supernatural encounter with Jesus. He tries to explain he’s normal his mind is normal they don’t believe him, a voice says run he runs out of that hospital and supernaturally he gets out of there there’s no way that you can get out of a high security mental hospital like that the way he did but 6 weeks later he decides to go back to the hospital. Gary that took what we Jewish people call Chutzpah nerve how could you go back to that place?

Gary: You know Sid I had the greatest uncanny peace inside of me that somehow I was never going to live as a fugitive on the run but God someway…I didn’t even know who He was but I had something inside of me that just said “Will you go back submit yourself to that mental hospital. And I remember knocking on the door of the mental hospital and they looked at me and they say “You have an APB for all cities states to find you, your marked, armed, dangerous, what are you doing here?” And I said to them if you will please I want you to understand and they called the guards and they got a hold of me and I said “Give me no drugs, do not put me in any isolation ward, put me in a mixed community where there’s men and women and I’ll show you that I am truly sane.”

Sid: So weren’t you afraid that they wouldn’t believe you just as they did 6 weeks earlier?

Gary: Well I tell you Sid I had all I had to believe in was that little tiny voice inside and the fear of knowing that these people don’t know God. They don’t believe in God they don’t have any reference to God I mean the fear of totally insane to convincing people you’re sane. I’ll tell you I just remember the gripping like cold fingers like and ice drip down the back of my neck while I’m standing there looking at this man and saying to him I want to come back into the mental hospital and prove I’m sane after being in there 6 weeks. And I mean to tell you I just was….I had no idea how God did it but He did it He produced the proof and they released me from the mental hospital with a clean bill of mental health.

Sid: And then so many wonderful things happened after that God restored your marriage he put you into ministry, he made you and put into business. You had multimillion dollar corporation and if there is ever been a man that has empathy for people with fear with the things that you went through in your life. Tell me as best you understand why you wrote the book “Make Fear Bow.” As I understand it this was not your idea this was God’s.

Gary: Yes it was I had a prayer meeting that I was going to be leading in London and before I left to leave the prayer summit in London I had the Spirit of the Lord speak to me for everyone in our church to write down the 4 greatest areas of prayer needs that they had. And I took it was well over a thousand prayer requests with me and I went into my room and I prayed over everyone of the points, over everyone of the people and I found that over 80% of all of the prayers needs circumvent or focus on the element of fear. And it was just like a shock to me realizing that you take 800 adults out of a 1000 and 800 of them are paralyzed by an influenced called fear. It was because of that that I wrote this book “Make Fear Bow” because I studied every cause of fear, every reaction of fear, every way that fear works whether it’s the individual or whether it’s a family, whether it’s a group whether it’s a society, it’s a nation and today we’ve got these people running around called terrorist. The issue is not that they kill people the issue is that they paralyze people with terror and the control that fear has. Out of that time of prayer I wrote this book and just like Marilyn Hickey wrote the forward of this and she did an acrostic that I wrote on the inside and she just elevated it to let it be seen of understanding of what fear really is and it’s simply this “F E A R” False Evidence Appearing Real.

Sid: And as I heard it mentioned fear is the opposite of faith.

Gary: Yeah.

Sid: And if that’s the definition of fear false evidence appearing real what’s the definition of faith?

Gary: Faith is the substance of things hopped for the evidence of things not seen. So faith is to God what fear is to the devil. Satan has access to produce images of the mind, information as it appears and there’s a multitude of areas that you can call them doorways of access that fear has to an individual and every one of those access doors of fear paralyze and literally hold a person at bay where they can’t do what God gave them the dream for.

Sid: Listen Gary if someone pokes a gun in your ribs and says “Give me your money or I’m going to kill you” it’s only natural to be fearful. And we can identify fear in that instance but you know what I believe and I’d like your spin on this “I believe that many people are paralyzed from accomplishing what God wants them to do in their life because of fear and they haven’t even identified that that’s the reason.

Gary: Yeah that’s absolutely true there’s already a predisposed mindset “I’m going to fail,” a predisposed mindset that “I saw another person do a similar thing they failed.” So the enemies voice speaks so suddenly and quickly that the never even attempt to believe God or take an action on their dream, on their future for what God says to them because the enemy interrupts the thought and says “It’s not going to work for you don’t even try it.”

Sid: Scripture says “Without faith you can’t please God.” In other words without trusting God how do you expect to walk in the invisible realm? So that’s why this whole fear thing is far more important; most people they hear fear “Oh well he’s talking about fear because of 9/11.” Well, yes you are but it’s way beyond that.

Gary: Absolutely this fear that we’re talking about is gripping people where they can’t drive over bridges. It’s gripping people where they’re afraid to even step on a step-stole and go up one step. It’s gripping people that have been through the pain of divorce and they fear the next relationship will again bring them the emotional and mental torment and pain. They fear having children because they’ve known someone who went through a challenging childbirth.

Sid: You know in your book you give a testimony of a woman that was sexually abused and she became a Christian and she married a fine Christian man but because of that fear she was not able to have normal sexual relationships.

Gary: And that lasted for years in her life until she read the book “Make Fear Bow” and identified that every time she was having what would be considered normal sexual relationships with her husband she was reliving that rape. And until she saw that it could be defeated once she got the truth she was free.

Sid: Gary I believe that number 1 that this is a book that God ordained. Number 2 if there is I mean one of the earmarks of the last days is “Men’s hearts will fail because of the fear of the things that are going on in the world.”

Gary: That’s right.

Sid: And so it’s an end-time book, it’s a God book, but even more important than that there is a presence of God on this book. I believe that if someone reads it they’ll actually experience a deliverance of fear.

Gary: Because I teach and I write out the prayer to pray that I’ve prayed that many have prayed and those prayers are so effective that God moves by that simple prayer.

Sid: I’ll tell you something if you could overcome the fear that I read about in your experience in Kenya you can overcome anything. If you can do it anyone else can do it because you do it through the anointing and the word of the Living God. Tell me what happened to you in Kenya.

Gary: I was opening a major crusade in the city right there in Kenya Nairobi the Capital city and we had everything set. The average attendance in the beginning would be about 100,000 people and then it would multiply and grow. And we were in a huge field area where massive platform and fans and the church choirs and all of the things had already been practicing and everything. And before I came out that first night to preach there was a knock on my door there were 2 policeman with full armor there, shields these metal shields with these little tiny slit in it and my person that was coordinating he comes and he says “Gary you cannot do this crusade.” I said “Why?” He said they busted our car up with bats, they broke in the windows, the kicked in the doors and the other people the 2 police they said that there’s only 2 of us authorized by this government to protect you. And you have 1000 people in a cult who are choosing to shoot you tonight and prove there’s no resurrection.

Sid: How many came in with guns that night?

Gary: What do you mean in the field?

Sid: Yeah.

Gary: There was over a 1000 people armed in the field to kill me that’s what…

Sid: So they didn’t want you to go out obviously. Look we’re out of time will pick up right here on tomorrow’s broadcast Mishpochah.

Sid: My guest by way of telephone is Dr. John Miller he’s a Chiropractor Tampa, Florida. He’s an expert in alternative medicine, vitamins and minerals, and other healing arts, but he says all of that is actually is contradictory with the foundational teaching that the first church had that’s been stolen and it has to do with communion. Would you continue teaching John?

John: Yes I would like to lay out through the Bible the types of the Body of Christ and how they would reverse the work of the devil. We started out with 1^st Corinthians 11 where Paul says “If you do not discern the Body of the Lord when you take communion you remain weak, sick and you die prematurely.” Now you cannot build doctrine off of typology but you can prove doctrine off of typology. I’d like to start right back in the garden where there was a tree of the knowledge of good and evil that Adam and Eve were not to eat of, but there was also the tree of life. And when they ate of the tree of good and evil God said “Let us put them out of the garden now lest they eat of the tree of life and live forever.” Well the curse for eating of the tree of good and evil was death. So that show if they walked over and then ate of the tree of life it would reverse the death curse they would live forever. Well all theologians agree that the tree of life in the garden was a type of Christ. So when we eat of the type of Christ, the bread of communion, we reverse the curse; now in the garden Adam sinned and became aware of his nudity. The nudity that Adam had was the sign that he had sinned. He was not aware that he was nude before he sinned and he put fig leaves on to try and make himself presentable to God but that didn’t work. God had to kill and animal and make clothes from the skin of the animal to cover up the fact that Adam had sinned to cover up the nudity. This is a picture of Jesus at the cross; it’s so important to see that when God started in the Garden His plan was on a set course before the foundation of the world Jesus was a lamb slain. So all of the stories in the Old Testament point to Jesus being the Lamb of God slain at Calvary. So blood had to be shed to cover up that Adam had sinned we have a type of the cross. Then when the people were in the… the Israelites were in Egypt God sent Moses to get them out and He told Moses to do these different miracles, ten miracles in all. I believe personally that that represents the law. God gave the law in the Old Testament and no one could keep it so no one could be saved. Paul says in the New Testament the law condemns you. The 10 miracles did not let God’s people go free, so they had to take the blood of the lamb and put it over the doorpost and when the death angel came through that night he didn’t kill the first born. So it required the blood of the lamb to set God’s people free then after they got out after the law, for 1500 years, God had the Old Testament people keep the Feast of Passover to remember His deliverance. So you have all of these types done in the Old Testament to point to Calvary. On this side of Calvary we have the bread of communion and blood of the wine the wine to drink looking back to Calvary. Calvary was the most important day that ever was or ever will be. Even worship in heaven is “Worthy to the Lamb that was slain” looks back. So all of the stories in the Old Testament look forward to Jesus on the cross and the New Testament looks back to Jesus on the cross by central theme. Now the lamb that they took the blood of doorpost that represented Christ the rest of the instruction was to roast a lamb and to eat all of it even the pertinents thereof. And God told Moses to tell the Israelites when they eat it have their sandals on have their robe on and a staff in their hand. In other words, when you eat the flesh of the lamb be ready to be physically delivered. The reason they need to eat the pertinents, all of the organs they had to eat because there’s always a spiritual and a physical meaning to everything that God does. When you eat the brain of that lamb it should not only bring healing but it should take on the mind of Christ because that lamb represents Christ. When you eat the eyeballs it should not only heal your eyes but you should take on the eyes of Christ. You should start seeing things through Christ eyes the way that He sees them. When you eat the heart it should heal the heart, but it should also take on the compassion and the love of Christ. So I have seen this many times not only in my own life but people that I have taught this to when they get away from taking communion their personality changes. They’re not as loving, they’re not as tolerant because when you eat the body of Christ you’re taking on those characteristics. So we have a type of eating the lamb causing feeling because in Palms 105 verse 37 it says “The Israelites came out with silver and gold and not one infirmed among them.” Now this was about 3 million Jews that had been in captivity about 400 years and they came out and there was not one sick one in their midst. So the blood of the lamb saved their life, the body of the lamb caused healing. Then in Numbers 21 we pick up another picture of the communion. God sent the manna as a type of Christ that took care of them physically met all of their physical needs. They came to Moses and said “Why did you bring us out in the wilderness to die there’s no meat here and our souls loathe this light bread.” They said that they hated the manna so God sent fiery serpents among them to bite them. And then they came to Moses and said “Oh we’ve sinned against God pray God that He would stop this.” So God told Moses “To take a serpent and put it on a pole and everyone that were bitten by the snakes were dying that would just look on that snake on the brass snake on the pole would be healed.” We have the same choice today; we can eat the light bread, the bread of communion the body of Christ and be healed, or we can be devoured by the serpent. The same law applies today. The people that take communion and walk in divine health and the people that don’t will be devoured by the serpent. We talked on a previous program about how everyone that Jesus healed in Acts 10:38 was oppressed of the devil. So all the diseases that Jesus healed the Bible says was an oppression from Satan. The good thing is all we have to do is look at the serpent of the pole.

Sid: Why did God pick the serpent on the pole as an example?

John: Because when Jesus took our sins in His body he became the essence of sin and evil. 2^nd Corinthians 5:21 “He who knew no sin became sin that we might be made the righteousness of God in Him.” In John 3:14 Jesus said “As Moses lifted up the serpent on the pole in the wilderness so shall the Son of man be lifted up.” It was Jesus Himself who likened himself to the serpent on the pole. Now unless you see Jesus becoming all the sin and evil you ever were or ever will be you will never see yourself as righteous. The Bible declares that you are righteous.

Sid: You’ve got to say that again that’s so powerful; say that statement again.

John: Unless you see Jesus with all the sin and evil that you ever were or ever will be He became that sin and evil you will never see yourself as the righteousness of God. That is the exchange, the cross is the exchange; we exchanged our sin and evil for His righteousness. But when Jesus took our righteousness, I mean our sin, in Him it’s spoiled Him He became sin that’s why the wind became fermented. The bread of communion could have no leaven in it.

Sid: The wine was fermented you mean it was wine and not grape juice.

John: Yes it was alcoholic.

Sid: How do you know that there’s whole sermons to prove it’s not?

John: Because the Bible says that they came to the communion table and they drank so much that they got drunk. And you don’t get drunk off of fresh grape juice.

Sid: Well that would be a miracle. (Laughing)

John: Yes. That was at Passover time and there was no Welsh’s bottle grape juice.

Sid: And there wasn’t even Manischewitz (Laughing) but I can tell you as a Jewish believer in Jesus, Jesus had wine no matter what you’ve been taught. But that’s not even the issue the issue is to understand the fermentation process to understand what Jesus did for us is that correct?

John: He became a snake for us yes. I had thought for 2 years “Why did you make such a fuss over there being no leaven in the bread but yet the wine was leavened it was fermented. After 2 years I was laying across the bed in a 100 year old building in Elam Bible Institute and God spoke to me He said “Because the bread is the body of Christ it never fore took of the sin. It never committed the sin. The bread represents the body no leavening no sin. But when Jesus took our sin in Him it spoiled His blood; Leviticus 11:17 says for the life of the flesh is in the blood and I give it to you for an atonement for your soul. So the life in your flesh is in your blood; the life of the flesh is in the blood.

Sid: I’m sorry we’re out of time…

SID: When I heard the revelation of the angel that Kynan Bridges saw, I can tell you it changed my life, and I promise you, it’s going to change your life forever. What happened?

KYNAN: I’m praying one day, as often I do, and meditating, and all of a sudden, I have an open vision of this angel. This angel is about nine, 10 feet tall. He is six feet wide with his chest span, huge breastplate.

SID: Can I have him on my basketball team?

KYNAN: Sure you can. And he has a sword, a golden sword. I mean, he’s massive, intimidating, regal, all in one. And I asked the Lord, I said, “Is this a mighty archangel?” And the Lord says the most interesting thing to me, he says, “That’s not an angel at all. That’s you in the spiritual realm.” And when I heard that, I was literally blown away. And the scripture that came to my spirit was that we are kings and priests unto our God, in the Book of Revelation. He’s made us through his blood, Yeshua, kings and priests. In other words, we have dominion. We are mighty in the spiritual realm. We are not paupers. We don’t have to be afraid of the devil. When we realize that person that I saw in that vision is us, the devil will literally flee from us.

SID: You know what? That’s the devil’s worst nightmare. You realize and come to your senses of who you are. You shared a story about the famous miracle worker, Smith Wigglesworth.

KYNAN: Yeah. He’s one of my favorites, very aggressive healing ministry, known for even punching people sometimes. And one night as the story goes, he’s in his house in England and he hears a rumbling downstairs, and you know, he senses that something is down there. And he goes downstairs and Satan is standing in his living room, physically manifested. And Smith Wigglesworth takes one look at Satan and says, “Oh, it’s just you.” And he goes back to sleep. And I love that story because what it does, it teaches us that we don’t have to be afraid of the devil. That is something that Satan has propagated because you cannot take authority over what you fear. You cannot take authority over what you fear. So once we demystify the enemy and realize that he is under our feet where he belongs, then and only then can we really take dominion over him. You know, Sid, it’s something that I call the ever-expanding kingdom. In other words, Jesus told us that the Kingdom of God is inside of us. But this kingdom is ever expanding, it’s oscillating inside of us. And as we yield to the King of Kings and we yield to his way of doing things, which is his Word, the Kingdom begins to expand inside of us from our spirit man, expanding out to our soulish man. And as it does that, anything in our soul that does not belong is driven out by the power of the Kingdom. You know, Jesus exemplified this. Everywhere he went he preached the Kingdom of God. What was he doing? He was releasing the culture of Heaven. And when he released the culture of Heaven, it released the power of Heaven, and whenever the power of Heaven was released, demons had to flee. The same is true of us. God wants the Kingdom to expand inside of us and outside of us to advance it to the last days.

SID: There is such a presence of God that’s just invaded this studio. Headaches are gone now in Jesus’ name. Kynan, anything you pray is going to happen. Pray now.

KYNAN: In the name of Yeshua, the name above every name, you know, he is King of Kings and Lord of Lords, I release a spirit of dominion and lordship over cancer right now in Jesus’ name. I release dominion over diabetes. I release dominion. Even now, if you will take dominion over the pain in your body, that pain will go instantly in Yeshua’s name. Right now I just curse the plan of the enemy over the people of God. Depression, you must go now. Suicidal thoughts, you must leave. Anxiety attacks, insomnia, you’re going to sleep sweeter tonight than you’ve ever slept in your entire life because the peace of God that passes all understanding will keep your heart and mind right now in Yeshua’s name. Just receive it Jesus’ name.

SID: Tell me what authority means.

KYNAN: Authority is really the legal right to act in a certain way. Authority means, you know, the Bible tells in Luke 10:19, it says, “Behold, I give unto you power,” is the word, exousia, in the Greek, authority. It means that we have the keys. So I want you to think almost like a gatekeeper or a groundskeeper. The groundskeeper has keys to access any door within that building.

SID: Of course.

KYNAN: In the same way, you and I through Jesus and through his name have the access to open doors and close them. That’s what authority really is. We can open doors of favor, open doors of prosperity, open doors of blessing in our lives to the authority vested in us.

SID: I tell you, all authority has been give unto Jesus and he’s saying to you now, go ye into all the world. The keys are there. They’re in your hands. Grab them.

Man 1: Lord, why haven’t I received my healing?

Woman 1: I feel like the enemy robs me of every blessing I receive from you, Lord Jesus.

Woman 2: Why am I facing such opposition?

Man 2: Oh Lord, when will I receive my breakthrough?

SID: Okay, I want to know, Thurman, how you can guarantee someone is going to be healed.

THURMAN: The only way you can guarantee God’s Word is to know what it says and believe it in your heart.

SID: So if you believe it in your heart, that’s how you guarantee it.

THURMAN: That’s right, yeah.

SID: So if you can’t guarantee it, that means you don’t believe it in your heart.

THURMAN: That’s absolutely right.

SID: Okay. I got it. Now you have this young boy, age 11, horrible condition, warts. And was it all over his body? Explain.

THURMAN: Yes. When his mother and dad asked me, when I started teaching just the Word of God in the Sunday school class, this couple was in that class, and they heard me teach things they had never heard before, that God would do miracles and healings, and things. So they invited me to their house, and I went up there, and I said, “What do you all need?” And they said, “Well our 11-year-old son here, we’ve taken him to doctors, they’ve burned warts off of him and his body is literally covered with warts.” And they said, “We even had a bunch of them burned off the back of his right hand and it just left two big rows of scars, but the warts came right back in him.” And so I looked at him. They brought him in. He sat down beside me. I looked over at him and I said, “Gee, Philip,” I said, “you got warts everywhere.” I mean, he had warts in his forehead, in his eyebrows, in his eyelids. He had warts in his nose. He had warts on his neck.

SID: Did you take any pictures of him?

THURMAN: He wouldn’t let me.

SID: Why?

THURMAN: He didn’t want nobody to see what he looked like. He hated himself. So he even told me, you know, I said, “Son, you got more warts than anybody I ever saw in my life.” He said, “And I hate myself.” He said, “Everybody at schools calls me Warty.” I said, “Well I understand, son.” But I said, “There’s something about God you got to know.” I said, “God will let you take those scars to your grave. But if you come to him in faith,” I said, “I guarantee He will take those warts and scars off of your body.” And so I said, “So we got to get in the Word.” I said, “Now the first thing we got to do,” I said, “we got to make sure that all of us are free of sin. We got to know that Jesus’ blood has covered us and if there’s any sin in our life, anything we’ve done wrong, we need to get rid of that.” And I said, “One of the major sins I’ve come to realize, especially in the church today, is the sin of unbelief.” I said, “We don’t believe these wonderful promises.” So I got the mom and the dad to repent of sin, and then for the next couple of hours, at least a couple of hours, I started building this boy’s faith. As I built his faith on the Word of God, after a couple of hours, I asked him the question. I said, “Son, do you believe that the Jesus that I’m talking about out of this Bible, with all the promises he made, do you believe he can take these warts and scars off of your body?” Little Philip said, “Mr. Scrivner,” he said, “after what I’ve heard you talk about in this book, I believe Jesus can do anything.” I said, “Son, that’s what Jesus can do.” I said, “He can do anything. He even says he can anything.” So I said, “Now then,” I said, “I want us all to kneel here and I’m going to take this wonderful promise of Matthew 18:19, which again says, I’ve used that verse a lot, Matthew 18:19, which says, “Again, I tell you,” now this is Jesus talking, too, by the way. Jesus said, “Again, I tell you that if two of you on Earth agree about anything you ask me for, it shall be done for you by my Father, which is in Heaven.” So we knelt and everybody made sure they repented of all their sins, mom and dad, and little Philip. And of course, like I say, Philip was 11. He had these warts since he was three. So eight years he had them all over his body. And so anyway, I told him, I said, “Now after Jesus heals you, I want you to know that when you go back to school this year, they’re going to ask what happened and you’re going to have to tell them that Jesus took these off you.” I said, “You know, they ain’t gonna believe you. They’re gonna laugh at you, but you got to stand on the Word of God.” And so anyway, we prayed. And then I stood up and after we prayed and I stood up, I looked at the mother and she asked me a question. She said, “When are they going to come off?” I said, “Well that’s the only thing God doesn’t tell me is when.” I said, “Now I guarantee you that if you’ll stay in faith with me and don’t get into any kind of sin or anything, unbelief,” I said, “I guarantee you in a few days to a few weeks at best, Philip won’t have a wart or a scar left on his body. I guarantee it.” But I said, “I guarantee you something else. When I walk out the door, there’s going to be an enemy.” And I said, “He’s going to come and he’s going to put his hand on your shoulder and whisper in your ear, ‘Now you don’t think just because this old grey-headed guy come over and prayed over you that God is going do anything. Remember, the doctors, the doctors couldn’t get them off. They burned off and they come right back and the scars are still there. So you don’t think just because he prayed this is going to go away.'” I said, “But don’t believe that lie. Don’t believe that lie.” I said, “Stand on the promises of God and I guarantee you Philip’s warts will go away.” Well the next morning, the mother goes in to check him and all the warts on his hands, fingernails and under his fingernails, on the backs of his hands, every wart on his hands were completely gone overnight. Now he still had lots of warts all over his body, but they were gone on his hands. Well three weeks later when I saw him in church for the first time, that little boy did not have a wart nowhere on his body. They were all gone.

SID: What about the scars from where the doctors cut them?

THURMAN: The scars were still there.

SID: Oh.

THURMAN: Now the scars were still there and when the mother gave me his hands, “Thurman, look.” All the warts were gone from Philip’s body, all under his clothes where you can’t see it, warts everywhere. Like I said, they were all gone. The only things left were those two rows of scars. I said, “Well Mama, according to Matthew 8, not Matthew, but Mark 11:23, which says, “Whatever I say with my mouth, if I believe with my heart I can have it.” So I am speaking to those scars and I’m going to guarantee you, according to the Word of God, by next Sunday, Philip will not have a scar left on his body. And next Sunday, when the mother came in, if you ever saw a charismatic mother in a Baptist church, we had a charismatic mother in that Baptist church. She was dancing, jumping, praising God. Even Baptists get excited when Jesus shows up.

SID: I’m going to tell you something. You’re going to get excited because if you will repent of your sins, if you will willfully choose to forgive everyone that has offended you, as Thurman prays, you will be healed. Would you pray for them right now.

THURMAN: Yes, yes. Father, in the name of Jesus, I thank you and praise you for your Word. I thank you, Lord, for forgiving us when we confess our sins and repent of our sins, and promise you we will never do those things again. And Lord, especially that sin of unbelief, I thank you for forgiving us of having our unbelief. And I thank you, Father, for being such a mighty, awesome God. And I thank you for restoring everybody, whatever their need is, may you meet that need of every person. Now Lord, give them the faith and the authority, and everything, to stand by your Word, on their word, and help them to get in your Word so they can learn these promises for themselves, so they can receive their healing and maintain it, in Jesus’ name. Amen, amen and amen.

SID: Let every man be a liar, but God’s Word is true. Believe it. Act it. Live it.

Sid: Now if you’re not red hot right now I’m going to introduce you to a friend of mine Dr. James Maloney he’s a Professor from Christ for the Nations in Dallas, Texas, and he literally travels the nations. I’m having difficulty Jim in that in my notes it says that you witnessed with your very own eyes a person in India whose hand was sticking out where the arm should be and when prayer occurred you saw the arm grow all the way out before your eyes.

James: That is true Sid.

Sid: Tell me about it I mean I never have seen anything like that before. (Laughing)

James: It was quite thrilling for all of us to see that. It touched a lot a lot of peoples’ lives there in that particular remote area in India.

Sid: Describe it I wasn’t there be my eyes right now tell me what happened.
James: Well, we just had thousands upon thousands of people that had come out and many of them had never heard about Jesus Christ. It was in a remote area in India Sid and I had a team of about 12-15 men and women various people from the United States. We went into that area and began to preach Jesus Christ and him crucified. And one of the team members a precious precious lady and I believe that she’s gone on to be with the Lord now but God mightily used her. And as we were ministering to the sick and to the afflicted there were 100’s upon 100’s of people sick, disease ridden, deaf ears needed to be opened blind eyes, crooked bones made straight. And this particular gentleman came up in the line and he had no arm we saw his hand by his shoulder but we couldn’t find his arm. And so I had this precious sister her name is Alma she just laid her hands upon him and she just prayed and really she didn’t even mentioned the name Jesus she barely got the name of Jesus out and all of a sudden the hand shock. I’ll never forget it it just caused you know chills to run up and down my spine. And that hand just went flying in the air and it was really great because with it thankfully there was an arm connected to it.

Sid: It would be even more supernatural if there’s no arm connected to it. (Laughing)

James: (Laughing) But it was just awesome and I’m telling you what praises just broke out among those precious Indians. More people came to the saving knowledge of Jesus. Of course it changed my life I didn’t sleep much that night after that miracle and created faith for many other things to be taken care of. And it just touched this precious lady’s life and of course the gentleman had a tremendous testimony so the next 2 to 3 days of the crusade meetings we would get him up on the platform and he would testify and he had this brand new arm. And of course everyone knew him so that of course just brought out more people out of the surrounding villages and so we just had a great time.

Sid: You know one of my board members his name is Jonathan Bernis and he has a Jewish ministry like myself. And he said “Sid you’ve got to come with me to India I have never seen such miracles that take place in India.” Why does miracles take place by many people that are praying in India and I don’t see that same degree in the United States? That’s a hard question but I really want to know the answer.

James: Well Sid it is a hard question and I don’t know of any single individual has the full answer I’ve got a few thoughts on it. As I’ve ministered in North America as well as in other areas of the world. We see God minister and His healing power and miraculous power among people here in America seen some traumatic things take place. But you when you go to a nation like India and there are just millions upon millions of people that are just laboring under just so many things and great oppressions and demonic strongholds in that nation.

Sid: Well I think we’ve got more demons that they do ours are just more sophisticated.

James: I think ours are just a little more sophisticated and maybe even a little religious a little bit.

Sid: Oh, you’re meddling now (Laughing)

James: I think that in India I mean here in America Sid it’s like you know if you get sick you know diseased or whatever we go to doctors and we thank God for doctors and nurses but you know people in India a lot of them they don’t have anywhere else to go to. And so when we come and share you know the full gospel that Jesus is not only our Savior but He’s also our healer when we receive Him they’re like children. I mean they just have this childlike faith and they just believe what you’re preaching and what you’re teaching. And you know the Bible makes it very clear that it is the gospel that we preach is the power of the Lord unto salvation and so the Holy Spirit quickens what you’re preaching them the simple gospel of the kingdom. And they receive as little children and they don’t have any other alternative.

Sid: You know I think that you really nailed it with the 2 reasons that you’ve come up. Here in America you get sick with modern science the way that it is today you go to a doctor and he fixes you up you don’t need faith at all. But in India you can’t go to the doctor you don’t have Plan B, you only have Plan A or you don’t you don’t corrected.

James: That’s correct and also too I think that there’s a principal we need to share with the audience that God is for everyone and every nation. These people you know many of them haven’t even heard about Jesus Christ. They don’t know the plan of salvation for humanity, so the Lord is really reaching out into those people so there’s tremendous anointing and healings that take place to rest their heart. Because we already know the greatest miracle’s the salvation of the soul. In America we’ve been quote unquote the same way over the years, you know a Christianized nation. And we’ve heard the gospel and you know many times you know we’ve heard it over and over…

Sid: We’re gospel hardened.

James: Yeah.

Sid: Literally in this country we’ve heard it for the 50th time where as the people around the world haven’t heard it for the first time.

James: That’s absolutely correct and it bears witness within their hearts and they receive Jesus and He loves them like He loves all of us. And they cry out to the Lord; I mean when we preach to them that Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever Sid we tell them that hey He shed His blood not only for our sins but for also placed upon His back the strips that were placed upon the back of Jesus for our healing. They just receive that message it’s no different to them they had never heard it before. They never heard a message that’s been proclaimed many times in America where Jesus deals with our sins but He doesn’t take care of our sicknesses. And so they’ve never heard that so there is nothing to unteach really you know.

Sid: None of that unbelief.

James: Yeah.

Sid: But you now Jim there another thing that intrigues me about you beyond being a professor at Christ for the Nations in Dallas, Texas. You have a ministry that takes you around the world you’ve been to something like 21 different nations you have an invitation to Kuwait because the truth is that you move in the gift of miracles. And however when I take a look at your background I say “What a miracle of God that you’re even sane and in your right mine.” I mean when you were a child you were totally neglected as a child, you went without food for days because your mother just couldn’t afford to help you and then you had a step-father that got back from the penitentiary and I mean it sounds like he would step on your face and beat you up against the wall. Would he really do that?

James: It was quite difficult the first 2½ 3 years of my life it really was difficult. God’s a good God and He sovereign and in His providential care He really did take care of me the first couple years of my life. I’m a miracle like many people.

Sid: You should have been in the penitentiary or dead with starting that way.
James: Yeah, yeah I mean it’s just the mercy of the Lord Sid my biological mom she was a young teenager herself and she didn’t have you know money to properly take care of her child. Her husband was in a penitentiary and she was a lonely teenager and so you know one afternoon she needed someone to talk to. So her husband was in the penitentiary and so she said “I’m going to go up here there’s this church up the road.” And so she went up and started counseling sessions with the pastor and sadly to say this was related to me years later Sid by my adopted parents that he took advantage of her emotional vulnerability and one afternoon in a counseling session I was conceived. And she was so afraid to tell her husband and it was in that era of time that he was not permitted to even visit her. He was in solitary confinement so she just kept her pregnancy a secret from him. And so about 2½ years later he comes home he’s paroled on good behavior supposedly and all of a sudden he sees me this 2 year old that could not possibly be his. And it was related to me as I said years later that the demon of anger rose up in him and the first thing that he did was just kick me right in the face and I just went flying across the floor. And then he just picked me up and just threw me up against the wall, this happened many many times over a span of time of about 8 or 9 months. I went through this type of abuse. Sid I have to just say right here that if it wasn’t for the provincial care of God I wouldn’t be here I mean I wouldn’t be here.

Sid: God is such a good God. Mishpochah wait until you find out how God is using Jim all over the world. But then you got then adopted by a nice loving family and you had an encounter with God how old were you when you had that encounter.

James: I was 14 years of age when I had an encounter with the Lord. I think because of that abuse and that sensing of rejection and feeling of abandonment that it had created some real woundings in my life. And my adoptive parents were wonderful people, but they were busy people you know they worked hard.

Sid: I’ll tell you what Jim hold that thought right there. Mishpochah he such an encounter with God and I believe that’s one of the reasons that he walks in such miracles. But I went to hear him speak about a month ago in Jacksonville, Florida because I’d heard a great deal about him. The Pastor there talked about a cassette series that Jim’s wife did on healing and what an impact it had on everyone that listened to it. So I said “I’ve got to listen to this series” so I asked the Pastor to make me a copy of it and he did and I’ve listened to it and I have to tell you that Jim’s wife has an anointing to just penetrate this unbelief. And there are areas of misunderstanding in healing that I believe are cleared up and it is without a doubt one of the finest teachings that I’ve ever listened to to build my faith. And I did say it did build my faith…