Sid: My guest is red hot for the Messiah, and by the time you read her book, or listen to her, I believe you’re gonna get infected. Your faith is going to zoom; your understanding of the power and the authority that God has given. You may be facing an impossible situation, if you’re not blink your eyes a few times and you will. Welcome to the human race, but we have a victory. My guests Clarice and Ronnie Holden, I’m speaking to them by way of telephone at their home in Shallotte, North Carolina. Ronnie was on top of the world, if you will. He had been a drug addict, an alcoholic, almost lost everything. Had a visitation from Jesus, set completely free of drugs, completely free of alcohol, red hot for Jesus; his business, everything he touched was prospering, and then on May 8, 2000 a drunk driver hit him. He had got catapulted out of his car, his body was broken, but the worst part was what was going on internally. They didn’t even know it, but peritonitis had set in, he had massive infections, his vital organs were literally rotting on the inside and the doctors didn’t even understand it. So they did an emergency operation and they came back and they told his wife “Clarice he has 3 hours to live.” She would not accept; she did not know what to do; she prayed and God showed her step by step what she had to do to save his life. On yesterday’s broadcast Clarice I said “There had to be some points because you’re human that it seemed hopeless.” Tell me about the worst point.

Clarice: Well it was a morning, early like 3:00 in the morning, and I had just fought so many fights that day. There was so many Code Blues, and after a while it just wore you down, because I never left the hospital. The enemy just come at me so strongly and said “You’ve got plan your husband’s funeral.” I said “No! No! No!” and I went in the restrooms and I started beating on the walls so loud and screaming so loud till I got it down in my spirit that I had to fight. I said “If someone had heard me they would have thought I was crazy.” But you know what, I had to do that, I had to get it out of my system because I was not gonna accept what he was trying to speak whispers into my ear, “That my husband was not gonna make it,” because I knew he would, and he did. I got victory that night, and I came out there was another battle that I had never ever doubted again. We again kept going through different things; the infectious disease doctors were called in because he did have a major infection through his body. The different doctors started asking me to pray, and they were telling me; they even had us praying for people in the Intensive Care because they needed help. It was such a time that our faith was built up that we believed, we just knew that he was gonna be fine. Here Ronnie is, we had him plugged up to healing scriptures, he’s in a coma, but people if your loved one’s in a coma think faith. I spoke faith, I wouldn’t let nobody come in there that did not believe the way I believed. I said “Do not be crying and wringing your hands. He is a healed man, he is healed.”

Sid: But there was a point though where you and your prayer partner Sandy were literally exhausted. You were standing in the hallway and you started hearing someone singing. Tell me about that.

Clarice: Yes, we actually started singing Sid. We were singing “He is the God That Healeth Thee.” This was our scripture. We sung the word of God, the truth to him, and over it. There was something going on in there and we knew it. It was Sandy and myself, my nephew. There was this lady, she was this cleaning lady, and as we were singing she was coming up and down the hallway just mopping and singing. We would sing “He is the God That Healeth Thee,” and she said “Amen, praise God thank you Jesus, thank you Jesus” is what she’d say. It was really strange because the elevator was right there. Well the elevator would come up and open up, and nobody come out, this is 3:00 in the morning. Nobody would come out, and it would go down, and it would come up, and nobody would be coming out. It was an eerie time, but we just felt the presence of God. That lady was such a precious lady. The next morning I asked them “I just wanted to know that lady’s name, to thank her.” I said “When is she coming back on,” and I explained, and they said “Mam there is nobody that works here like that.” I said “Yes there is” and I explained it to them. They said “No mam not anybody here that looks like that.”

Sid: What type of feeling did you have when she was “Amening” and she was there, and the elevator was opening and closing by itself? What was going on in your spirit.

Clarice: It was jumping. My spirit was jumping up and down because your you know how your faith when it starts…

Sid: Are you telling me that was an angel?

Clarice: Sid I don’t know if she was an angel or not, but I felt the presence of God, and I have never been able to find this lady.

Sid: Now your husband, from what I understand started getting better.

Clarice: He did.

Sid: You know what, would you put Ronnie on right now

Clarice: I sure will.

Sid: because he’s in a coma for 21 days and his wife and her prayer partner are praying for all there worth. The doctors are saying “He’s starting to get better,” but you were having your own experiences Ronnie with angels. Tell me about that.

Ronnie: Well it was very strange, I never knew I had been in a wreck I was unconscious. I could see my room, and remember I had this huge hospital room and I had a picture window from ceiling to the floor. My bed was jacked up and I could see out the window overlooking the harbor. I remember thinking the last time I was at this hospital it was 3 miles from the river, they must be having more business they’ve built more since I’ve been here. I would lay there and watch the boats in the harbor and these people would come into the room, mostly 2, sometime it would be 3 people come into the room. They just sat around and read the paper they looked like ordinary people that just sat with me, but I didn’t know who they were. One day I just heard His word spoken to me saying “I sent My angels to watch over you.” I remember since then I had just relief that I knew I was going to be okay. They looked just like regular people; they stayed with me all day, and at first it seemed like they started leaving at night. Then they would come and take me down to the harbor. We would leave the hospital at 5:00, and they’d take me down to the dock. They had like a 100ft. schooner tied up there. I grew up around boats love boats. I just felt like something God sent to comfort me. They took me on the schooner at night, and I had this stateroom it had teak and mahogany it was just polished it would just shine. I would look outside the window and see the moonlight and see the water outside. I hadn’t had anything to eat or drink in about 30 days. I reckon I was craving to eat even though I was unconscious, but they had bowls of fruit, and I remember the fruit tasted so good it just run down my mouth it felt like. They had the ice water, and then I was standing out on the boat. The next morning they said “We have to go back to the hospital,” and we went back to the room and they stayed with me in the room, and they were there constantly.

Sid: Now you were in a situation… Would you put Clarice back on? Ronnie was in a situation where remember he was given 3 hours to live. So he’s in a coma for 21 days, ever since that cleaning woman showed up he started getting better. He’s having visitations from angels. Now Clarice you didn’t know all this was going on with the angels did you?

Clarice: No I didn’t.

Sid: So what happened at the end of the 21 days that he was in a coma?

Clarice: Well right before he came out of the coma that… Like I said it got worse again. That particular night I just walked in there, they were working on him again. Sid I just fell to my knees in the middle of that Intensive Care room, this big circle, and I tell you that I just cried out to God and you know what, I did not care that there were a lot of people in there. That’s what makes the difference, God knew my heart. I didn’t care I was after one thing getting my husband healed. That time, Ronnie, he was kind of bad and I went in I started talking to him and I said “Ronnie you have got to fight” because he was kind of failing again, it was kind of going downhill. I was screaming at him “I’ve done everything I can do you have got to fight!” I want him to tell you what happened to him that night.

Sid: Okay Ronnie what happened that night?

Ronnie: One night, I don’t remember when it was. The angels were in the room and this big man came through the door. He looked like he was 7 foot tall, dark skinned he looked Italian;he had like an Armani suit on really dressed. I had a very uneasy feeling when he came in I just felt an uneasiness. He went over and just leaned against the wall and just looked at me. I heard them talking about the angel of death, and he stood there and he started towards the bed, and the angels got up and stood between he and the bed where I was laying on. They started talking to him, and he glanced and he finally went back out the door. I remember such a relief when he left.

Sid: Our time is up.

Sid: My guest by way of telephone speaking to him at their home at South Beloit, Illinois is Ben and Brenda Peters; now on yesterday’s broadcast we found out that Ben came from quite a godly heritage of grandparents in ministry.  And he went to Bible college and he wasn’t backslidden or anything, but he was just arrested by the Holy Spirit when he was asked in a simple dorm prayer meeting “What is your burden?” He realized that he didn’t have any supernatural burden for the lost for anything.  And at that moment he had an encounter with the Holy Spirit his heart was changed and he became such an intercessor for others that even as he explained on yesterday’s broadcast you could hear the tears welling up within him I could hear it in his voice.  And then he began to have such a burden that he would wake up two hours early in the morning and sometimes he had never fasted before, sometimes he would even fast breakfast because Ben you said to me “The presence of God was so wonderful it was better than food.”

Ben: It sure was, it sure was and the incredible thing about it is that the scripture that say “They that sow in tears will reap in joy.”  It was such a strong desire to see the power of God released again to bring souls to Christ. Just a couple of years later a revival came to our city and it wasn’t the fullness of what I’d asked for but it was the first fruits.  And then in 1973 I traveled with a man of God that we had met and he took me to Argentina, and I was just a young man still, but the power of God moved so mightily there that we had six weeks of nonstop miracles and salvation, souls being saved.  He had a strong prophetic ministry that we partly inherited I believe. During that time he would get words of knowledge for people; he would prophesy he would see visions and people would be healed.  And we had deaf and dumb born…three young men that were born deaf and dumb that were healed during those meetings. I saw every other kind of sickness and disease healed in that time and it was the most joyful time in my life.  I always remind people that the sow in tears will reap in joy if you don’t faint you will see the results.  When you pray in intercession and when their tears flowing down your face you know that the Holy Spirit is moved you to pray and when He moves you to pray He will fulfill the desires of your heart and you will see those prayers answered.

Sid: I also have on the telephone Ben Peter’s wife Brenda. Brenda really moves in very accurate prophesy and I have some questions for Brenda.  First of all was there anything prophetic when you met Ben at Bible School and ended up marrying him?

Brenda: Getting to know Ben was very special to me because I came from a non-Christian background and I was learning in my quiet times that were assigned to us to listen to God.  And after one of our missions meetings on a Friday night I was working in gratis and I had been in the Bible College approximately half a year. Ben came down stairs while I was setting up the tables and I was talking to one of my girlfriends who was assisting me and I looked up and when I looked up and caught Ben’s eyes it was as if I was looking right into the depths of his heart and I knew at that moment there was a presence of God and I knew at that moment the Holy Spirit was saying, yeah the Holy Spirit was saying to me “He’s the one.”

Sid: Well how long did it take from that moment to the time you got married?

Brenda: Probably one year; we were engaged within a year and married about a year and a half later.

Sid: Alright tell me I’m very intrigued over your gift of prophesy; when did you realize you were prophetic and how does it operate?

Brenda: I didn’t realize I was prophetic until I became a pastor’s wife and then we worked in a small country church.  Ben served under a senior pastor who moved in the prophetic continuously he had a strong gift of knowledge.  As I basically served and encouraged people all the time I had a need to encourage people. I would always find myself looking for the qualities in their life and going past the negative and this actually became the roots of the prophetic for me on my journey.

Sid: Give me a few examples of how the gift operates with you; maybe specific examples.

Brenda: I realized that the prophetic was very strong on my life after taking classes on the prophetic for a season of time and we went to a meeting under our leader and he released us to prophesy and he turned to me and he said, “Brenda I believe I’m supposed to give you the mic tonight” and we began to minister over a large group of pastors in Canada.  When I took the mic the presence of God came on me so strong I began to prophesy with a powerful anointing I began to speak into every pastors life.  There had to be about 20 pastors a powerful word and I knew that it was God because I could not have made any of that up.

Sid: Were you a kind of a little child that was just amazed that God used you like that?

Brenda: I was.

Sid: And out of curiosity does He operate in other prophetic areas with you such as dreams or visions?

Brenda: Actually there are times when I’m prophesying and I’ll get mental pictures or visions and those visions or mental pictures will be related to the person that I’m standing in front of.So I will speak into those pictures right at the same time that I’m prophesying.

Sid: And when you see those pictures is it like you have to have your eyes closed or do you see them on top of the person. I mean I’m just plain curious tell me how it operates.

Brenda: I understand no actually it’s a mental picture I’m looking directly into their eyes my eyes are wide open; there are times when I’ll close my eyes and pray so that I can just grab the picture and the word I’m getting at the same time and then I’ll look into their eyes.  But I’m seeing the picture similar to a mind it’s just a picture I’m getting in my mind.

Sid: Okay what is God showing you currently?

Brenda: I’ve had visions related to what’s going on in the world in this hour; I have actually seen visions of angels in the Heavenly realm. It’s as if there are Lieutenant Commander Angels holding back the hosts of angels that are being prepared to be released to us to assist us in bringing in the lost for the harvest that’s talked about in the Bible.  I have been getting excited because I’m seeing the youth going out in buses. I have actually seen visions of youth on stadium platforms and going out in buses and worshipping and opening the Heavens for revival.

Sid: Well I have to tell you Brenda I’ve never met you in person at least I don’t believe I have.Have we had our paths cross?

Brenda: No I’ve seen you on television.

Sid: Okay of course I’ve never met your husband Ben but both of you the presence of the God is so strong on both of you.If I had to say to you Brenda what is the strongest passion you have within you what would you say?

Brenda: The strongest passion I have is to go deeper into the heart of God and then carry that presence everywhere I go to raise up those that are broken and hurting.I find myself with this urgency when I’m walking outside I look for people to encourage; walking in airports I look for people to encourage I just encourage and God will give me a prayer for them and I’ll say “Can I share this prayer I’m getting a prayer for you?”  And then I’ll prophesy into their lives and they’ll cry; tears will happen. Grocery stores I’ll stand in the line and they presence of the Holy Spirit will move on me and I’ll just begin to speak to the grocery clerk “You know God has a prayer for you can I share it?”  They’re crying, just bikers I’ve ministered to bikers, I’ve ministered to truckers in truck stops. I just have this cry in my heart to raise people up from their brokenness and give them vision for how God sees them.

Sid: Okay I have read your husband’s book “Prophetic Ministry.” He says that everyone can move in the prophetic which is God’s method that or signs and wonders to arrest the nonbeliever’s attention to preach the gospel.  Do you believe that too that everyone can move in prophesy?

Brenda: Very definitely when we were called out of our church actually we received a prophetic word about moving into the prophetic and traveling and when we launched into that ministry I found myself actually looking for places to get away with God.  I remember the Baptist camp I found a cross in San Diego and went up to the cross every morning in the early morning hours and I would just lay on my face at the foot of the cross and put worship on and invite the presence of God the Holy Spirit.  The Holy Spirit would show up and I would be on my face in prayer one to two hours every morning experiencing His presence.

Sid: Now the key was not that you found a particular place by a cross the key was that you found a place and spent a few hours quality hours with God every day.

Brenda: Exactly with worship and I really believe the time that you just rest in the presence of God with worship and then open up the word and He’ll speak to you.  But it’s a time to listen and then you have…

Sid: I’ll tell you what let’s…we’ll pick up right here on tomorrows broadcast.

Sid: I’m going to tell you something when you understand how the Bible clearly points out the next war in the Middle East it’s eminent it’s different than most people think and the Bible actually names the players, it names the countries, it even tells you what’s going to happen to each country that’s involved in the endtime war.  It tells you the future of America.  Bill Salus has spent the last eleven years when God gave him this revelation just doing research, and I believe he did it just for you.  Bill first it’s important to understand because most believers do not understand the roots of the conflict.If you don’t understand the roots of the conflict when you read today’s headlines you don’t have a clue of what’s going on it’s like seeing the tip of the iceberg but 90% of the iceberg’s under the water and you’re trying to make decision based on that 10% that you can see with your naked eye.

Bill: Absolutely Sid they don’t understand the roots of the conflict.  Six decades have come and gone and the conflict is worse.The enemies of Israel have more dangerous weapons than ever before.  The attitude is that they don’t want the Jewish State to exist and this is something that’s not going to get better according to Bible prophecy it will come out and play out in an Arab Israeli war written about 3000 years ago by the Psalmist Asaph one of King David’s worship leader who was also a prophet/seer.  But you’re right there is an ancient hatred that the Bible speaks about in the Hebrew words are “Olamebam.”  And it talks about it being an existence from time and memorial and resurfacing throughout time even to the present.  And when these two words are put together Sid it’s very definitive; it’s a condition stemming back long ago in ancient times perpetuated throughout time manifesting into hostility with no apparent end in sight.  In other words it’s cancerous it will not go away it needs surgical removal and unfortunately that means war.

Sid:Now can man, in any way you understand, be able to orchestrate peace and not have this horrible scenario occur that we see in the Bible that you’ll be explaining this week?

Bill:  Well, man has tried and man could.Actually there’s a plan that God had put together in Jeremiah 12 verses 14- 17 that I point out in my new book.  That God actually had His own peace plan together for the nations when the Jews came back into the land how He would set the stage for that to be all harmonious, but of course that required that the Arab populations would accept the re-gathered nation of Israel the rebirth nation of Israel and they would worship Jehovah not Allah.  It required a few basis things, but I point this out what they are and that’s not what’s going on unfortunately.  So God had a compassionate roadmap plan a peace 2 state solution, a peace plan together but there in reach of that.  The Arabs are in breach of that and they’re going to confederate according to Psalm 83 and try to wipe Israel off the map Sid that’s what I think is in the makings; I think the Arab spring is pointing in that direction.

Sid:Now you point out reasons why you feel that this is going to happen soon; what are the reasons for the next Middle East War that had to occur in order for it to happen?

Bill:  Well because you know there’s 6 decades have gone on.The Arab Spring has created a very unstable situation over there in the Middle East.

Sid:That’s where everything all of these Arab nations the governments are being toppled and the wrong guys are getting control.  You know what I was thinking Bill, this could have never happened without Facebook, and the computer, and the communication that people have now.  I mean we needed literally needed a computer for Psalm 83 to happen.

Bill: Well you know it’s interesting you’re absolutely right when this Arab Spring was going on the liberal pundits thought it was nothing more than the youth over there driven by the social networks like you said Facebook, Twitter, etcetera.Looking out of State Central media and 7th Century Islam into life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.  And that’s all wonderful and we wish that for them, western style democracies, but that’s not what’s happening Sid.  We’ve got a Syrian revolution that’s gone on since March of 2011 still ongoing as we speak.You’ve got a Muslim Brotherhood now who’s oppressed for forty years in Egypt that will be calling for Sharia law that is now in power.

Sid:Now they have open access to our White House, I find that outrageous!

Bill:  Well, they do and you know their President Mohammed Morsi is the consummate politician he has met with Hillary Clinton, he has met with Leon Panetta, but he has also met with the Hamas he has also met with Mahmoud Ahmadinejad of Iran.  He’s also met with Erdoğanof Turkey.  So if you read behind the scenes you start to recognize that he is just playing politics presently at this point in time.  They have agenda, they want to unite the Arab states through Islam, through Sharia law and they want to march as a capitol; not Cairo, but Jerusalem and this was one of the campaign plans by Mohammed Morsi that had been advocated before he became president.

Sid:President of Egypt, but go ahead.

Bill: You know the stage is really set and like you said, what’s interesting is that we have these leaders Mubarak who ruled Egypt for 30 years, and the Tunisian guy Ali for 23 years, and Gaddafi was 42 years, and even the Saleh of Yemen was 43 years.  These long standing leaders who were really not threatening Israel in a war at any point in time; they’re gone but you know who’s not gone are the people that want to wipe Israel off the map:Ayatollah Khomeini, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, Bashar Assad, Hassan Nasrallahof Hezbolla, and Mohammed Morsi of Egypt.  You know I mean and we’re told in Daniel 2:21 that “It’s the Lord who changes times and seasons and raises and removes kings; He give wisdom to the wise and knowledge to those with understanding.”  And I think the wisdom to the wise is that the leaders that would want to wipe Israel off the map are in place; the weapons are in place the attitude is in place and that we need to be prepared for missiles to fly in the Middle East.  And Sid that’s an imminent concern I have right now.

Sid:And how about Syria and we know but we don’t know but I believe that all the chemical weapons that were in Iraq are now in Syria ready to be turned on its own people and perhaps Israel.

Bill:Well, it’s a…Syria had their own weapons program once upon a time and it was very advanced.  And there’s good reason to believe because even Saddam Hussein one of his upper echelon individuals named George Sada has come out since Hussein has fallen and said “Yes we did have chemical weapons and yes they were moved into Syria.” Now Syria supposedly has the largest undisclosed, we believe third in the world, undisclosed arsenal of chemical weapons and they’ve been moving them around because of the concerns of what’s going on with the freestanding army and the revolution over there,and supposedly stored in around 20 different sites.  Sid you know just the other day Bashar Assad went out and said “Look if there is international intervention into his revolution he is there, he will die in Syria he is not going to leave and the Middle East will start to fall down like dominoes.”  That was a quote from Bashar Assad of Syria he is not going to do what Muammar Gaddafi did take a bullet to the head without doing something.  And that’s the concern and as a matter of fact he said I think it was in November of 20ll “That if the International Community get’s involved in his revolution” and at that time he was specifically referring to NATO he said in 6 hours I will send missiles into Tel Aviv and I will have Hezbollah send missiles into Tel Aviv.  Well Sid what is Israel going to do if that happens especially if there’s chemicals.  Now you’re dealing with another Bible prophesy probably inter-related with Psalm 83 and Isaiah 17 which talks about the destruction of Damascus the world’s oldest and continuously inhabited city dating back before the time of Abraham over 4000 years ago home to several million Syrians being destroyed.  It says “It will cease to be a city it will be a ruinous heap.” And what’s very detailed about that is Isaiah 17 prophesy Sid is that it goes on to say in verse 9 that it appears to be the IDF in self-defense that has to that.  And in verse 14 of Isaiah 17 it says “At evening tide you see Him.”  Referring to Damascus in the personal pronoun “and in the morning he is no more.”  This is a portion of those who plunder us and those who rob us.

Sid:Okay tell us about how well armed is Hezbollah?

Bill:  Well Hezbollah who has lopped 4,000 rockets into Israel in the summer of 2006 and kept a lot of people in Israel in bomb shelters for 34 days according to the UN resolution 1701 was supposed to dismantle those at that time.We believe now they’ve got 50 to 60,000 missiles.  We believe they’ve got Scud D missiles that they got from Syria, now Scud D Sid are the most advanced Scud’s in the world and they’re not those throw a prayer out and hope that Scud ace thatSaddam Husain had these are Scud-D’s; they can go 400 miles in pin point accuracy and hit within a 20 yard target.  I mean they can hit in the middle of any synagogue they want; they can hit the Dimona if they wanted the nuclear plant out of Israel.

Sid:Okay I see the picture, Iran has nuclear power, we have the Muslims acting crazy attacking our embassy. Hezbollah has 50,000 some rockets with pinpoint accuracy.  Syria has got the chemical weapons.  I mean and this is the whole war the nations involved and we’ll get into it later this week all outlined in Psalm 83.  So I have two questions for you number one, “How imminent is this?

Bill: Well, I don’t see anything standing in the way when you understand Psalm 83 and the nations involved I don’t see anything standing in the way right now of Psalm 83 happening.  Peace talks have failed the only thing, the only two things, the only preconditions are a peace treaty between Egypt and Israel, which was formed in 1979 I believe with Jimmy Carter and a Peace treaty that was formed with Jordan that was formed in 1984 with Bill Clinton.

Sid:And you know I have to interrupt because we’re running out of time right now. However, a lot of people are thinking “Well, what is this got to do with me, I mean I’m just a member of the country.”  No, no, no if you’re on the right side of the fence with the Jew in Israel the last days you’re going to be like a magnet attracting God’s blessings.  If you’re on the wrong side of the fence with the Jew in Israel if you don’t understand in the last days you’re going to be attracting things that won’t be good.

Sid:I believe the closer we get to the return of the Messiah the more the missing pieces will come into focus.  And that’s why I have Bill Salus on the telephone; Bill has spent the last 11 years researching what’s going on in the Middle East, the fate of America, and as far as I’m concerned this is a missing ingredient that once you understand this you’ll be able to put end-time Bible prophecy much better.  Bill why does God make prophesy such a mystery?  I am one of these people that say “I like one and one to equal two, I like things to be logical, just show me what it is I’ll pray it and do it.”  Why is it so confusing to so many people?

Bill:   Well, it’s interesting and I think where it draws our attention to Isaiah 46 verses 9 and 10 said where God says “He is God there’s none like Him declaring the end from the beginning, things not yet done seeing his council still stand.”  See He holds Bible prophecy to His authentic sovereignty of His own and that how it’s authentic sovereignty.  But once we start to understand prophesy because in some parts of prophesies we do get an enormous amount of detail.  We start to realize that God…prophesy is for us to inform us, not to impress us, God’s not someone with too much time on His hands, He’s the one who holds all time in His hands. And we should be thankful that He wants to share this upcoming information for us like a loving Father would.  So Bible prophesy which is about a third of the Bible Sid is extremely important we can’t discard it and yet many of us myself including came to the Lord through Bible prophesy.It becomes a witnessing tool,as a matter of fact it says in Revelation 19:10 that the Spirit of Prophecy is the very testimony of Jesus Christ.  Only He can say that, His testimony is prophetic.  So Bible prophesy is an amazing part of the Bible and unfortunately seldom taught in many of the churches today.

Sid:Now, there have been a whole series of what I consider supernatural events for you to get this revelation, digest it and be able to put it out in a form we understand.  Tell me a little bit about how this amazing revelation came to you.

Bill: Well, it’s interesting like I said, “I came to know the Lord through Bible prophesy, I was actually attending a Bible study of a scholar and he was doing the Book of Revelation.  And so I immediately got interested in the Bible and especially in the prophetic aspects of the Bible. I thought well, I’m going to study Bible prophesy I want to study the Bible prophesy that’s most relevant for my time, my families time, my children and grandchildren’s time.  I want to know it all I want to study it all I want to know about the tribulation and times and all of that.  But there’s something right now or is there a shoe that fits right now that would equip me for the days for which I live?  Which I think is really the importance of Bible prophecy; so I started being connected to, especially in the event of September 11^th when the twin towers were toppled, I started realizing listen this is about terrorism, that’s the ugly byproduct of the Arab-Israeli conflict.  And immediately my attention was drawn to those Middle-East prophecies dealing with those ancient territories that surround Israel and Syria and Jordan and Lebanon and the terrorist populations.  And I just became obsessed with it to be honest with you Sid; I felt like every time I would sit down at my computer open it up and every morning before I went to work. I had a mortgage company at the time this was about 20 years ago I would realize listen Lord I can’t go anywhere without You inspiring me to find out where you want me to go.  And as I would think I need to pick up where I left off the day before I would go back into that section of scripture and the next thing you know I’d be out somewhere else where the Lord took me.It was just like a miraculous relationship with the Lord; being able to find things He always showed up, He always showed up and took me where He wanted me to go inside of the Bible.

Sid:Now when the towers toppled, 9/11 and you started doing a lot of your studies God literally gave you a clear message, what was that?

Bill:  Well, the message was, well it’s was interesting because I was wondering the world had questions when that happened.  You know what is this, is the Armageddon, I would be listening to the radio shows and there was a harvest that was developing right over there because of what was going on and pastors were going over there and they were preaching the gospel.  But no one was really coming up with a response to it and I had been deeply imbedded in studying this stuff.  I heard one pastor well, known pastor say “You need to focus on Ezekiel 38 and 39.”  And here’s what’s going on and Sid for your listeners that aren’t familiar with that maybe we’ll be talking about it, but that’s a Russian, Iranian, Turkey coalition comes against Israel in the ladder days.

Sid:And most people, most Christians think that’s the next big war on the horizon if you talk to them.  But you say “No.”

Bill: Right a lot of them do believe that it’s eminent and so I want to tell you my reasons why I say it’s not eminent, why it’s near but not next.  But that’s why this one pastor said “Keep your focus on that.”  And that was the best answer that I’d heard but I as I was saying just a moment ago it’s not about Russia, you know it was not about Russia, that was about terrorism.  And so what I realized is that the Bible has to say about how terrorism came into being from the Arab Israeli conflict, which is that conventional method of warfare that the Arabs adopted after their conventional warfare failures of 1948, ’67, and 1973.  And what became clear to me is what follows, this is going to come to a climatic Arab Israeli war that’s described in Psalm 83, and it’s going to put everything else in place.  Once that happens the Israel that Russia invades in Ezekiel 38 that dwells securely in the last days, and there is whole laundry list that I can tell that describes that Israel. Ezekiel is so descriptive, that Israel, will come into place, but that Israel is not in place right now, it’s not dwelling securely without wall, bars on our gates and receipt of great fortune because Russia comes, is coming after it’s plunder.  Now don’t get me wrong we know that Israel is blossoming and it’s discovering natural gas and it’s just amazing, that’s a miracle in itself.  But the Israel that Russia forms a coalition to come and invade for great plunder and booty dwelling securely it doesn’t exist and the reason it doesn’t exist right now is because of the very nations listed in Psalm 83 that surround Israel that want to wipe Israel off the map.  That’s through the mandate of Psalm 83 verse 4 that they would cut them off from being a nation; that the name of Israel would be remembered no more.

Sid:You know it’s interesting I have often pondered Ezekiel 38, 39 that Israel will be invaded for a plunder, my spiritual logic says “That means they have to be very very prosperous so there for if I was interested in investing which I’m not, but if I was I’d be investing in Israel.”

Bill: Well, I concur Sid, however, you know we need to think about this too, because I get asked that question quite a bit by my friends in finance also a lot of my Jewish friends.  And I say “I do believe there is a greater Israel coming, a greater, a safer Israel coming in the aftermath of the IDF victory over the Psalm 83 war.  But we have to remember that when that war takes place you’re investments and your holdings over there in Israel should you invest they could suffer.  And that’s not going to be real good there for a period of time when a war’s going on.  Now Israel wins and Israel can…

Sid:Yeah, but guess what take any country in the world they’re going to have rough times because yet once more I’m going to shake this earth and those that are not on a firm foundation there going to fall.  I want to read a quote of yours about terrorism.  It says “Terrorism is the ugly byproduct of the Arab-Israeli conflict and that the Bible speaks volumes about what follows,” explain.

Bill:  Well exactly and that’s the whole Psalm 83 scenario.The attitude that’s involved in Psalm 83 and I hope we have time to develop this Psalm this prophesy for your audience here.  But it’s ancient hatred that’s long standing that’s been developed in the religion of Islam that’s embracing the Middle East over there and they are going to want to come against Israel, they have tried to in those various wars I told you about since Israel became a nation.  It’s sort of suspended now but then there’s no peace talks going on nor will there probably be at this point because Israel is not going to concede land that’s acquired in 1967 which is becoming a precondition of the Palestinians wanting peace.

Sid:You know remember the uproar that occurred when President Obama said that “Israel has to go to their pre ’67 borders.”

Bill:  Well, yeah and President Netanyahu was over here speaking to our congress and saying “That’s not going to happen” and in an essence when he came over and spoke that to the Palestinians was a declaration of war for all intense and purposes because to them.they want that land.  They want the Palestinian state with Jerusalem as its capital and they want the West Bank and the Gaza and they want to bridge it and these…

Sid:And you know what bothers me Bill is that, well like let’s take one of the three DVD’s and your book that we’re offering, but take one of the DVD’s “The Roots of the Mideast Conflict.”  Number one, most people don’t know the historical order as to why there is such hatred today.  I mean it seems to me if I was a member of the State Department, if I was a Congressman, if I was a Senator, if I was in the Whitehouse, if I was on the Cabinet, if I don’t understand the roots of the mid-East conflict how could I possibly give confident advice?

Bill: Well, and that’s exactly it and that’s why for 6 decades plus now there’s been no resolution to the Arab Israel conflict and it’s getting worse.  And you know ultimately land for peace deals are not prescribed in the Bible here this is God’s land and Israel’s being brought back into it.The Arabs want the Israeli’s to recede rather they’re expanding after 1967 they almost tripled their size.  God said they’d be coming back into the land numerous prophesies.

Sid:Bill, we’ve just run out of time.  But what I want our Mishpochah to do is uncover the missing piece of prophesy, the next war in the Middle East.  The experts literally have over looked this and the fate of America when you understand this you’ll see the fate of America.

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here with Tony Kemp. And Tony, I don’t get it. I have read it’s too late for me. I’ve read the Bible. I don’t understand how someone could think, once saved, always saved. Tell me why that’s wrong.

TONY: Well first of all, Jesus said in Matthew 24, speaking to his disciples, he says, “He who endures to the end the same should be saved.” Jesus is talking to those that are his followers, his disciples, and he’s saying, you must obey me to the end of your lives, to go to Heaven and to go to glory. In addition to that, the apostle Paul, who was the great teacher of grace, said in Romans 11, he said, “Remember now, both the goodness and the severity of God on those that sinned and failed God’s severity came upon them. But God said on you with goodness, if you continue in this goodness,” meaning continue to obey the teaching of Jesus the Messiah, he said then, “If you refuse to obey the teaching of Jesus to the end of your life and you backslide,” he said, “God will cut you off.” And this is what he said, Sid. He said, if God did not spare the natural branch, take heed that God does not spare you.

SID: That’s what I was reading. I don’t understand. Unless you lift scripture out of context and do not look at all scripture, that’s the only way you can come up with that, really.

TONY: Not only that, the apostle of love, John, who wrote the Book of Revelation, God comes to John and through the person of Jesus by the spirit, and Jesus begins to talk to the church in emphasis and says, “I have something against you. You have left your first love. You’ve backslid.” He said, “Repent and do your first works again.” Then Jesus speaks to John about Sardis, and this is what he says: “You have a name that lives,” indicating at one time you were born again, you had a salvation experience. But Jesus says, “You need to remember from where you have fallen and you need to repent.” And then Jesus says this: “You have a few names of Sardis who have not defiled [unintelligible]. They shall walk with me and right.” And what Jesus is saying, is you have some people who are living a clean life, a holy life, a righteous life before me, and they’re going to glory. Then Jesus says one other thing. He says, “He who overcomes,” meaning overcomes sin, because Jesus defeated sin, “that same person will have their name in the Book of Life. But the person who surrenders to sin and does not continue to follow Jesus to the end,” he said, “I will block that person’s name out of the Book of Life.”

SID: Okay. What would you say, and I think you’ve almost answered the question, to those that say, yes, you have to repent when you’re saved. But once you do that, since Jesus already died for all of your sins you don’t have to repent any more.

TONY: Well let’s take a look at this. Because Jesus speaks, in Chapters 2 and 3 of the Book of Revelation, to the seven churches, and to five of those churches he tells them to repent. In addition to that, you have in Acts, Chapter 8, Phillip the evangelist preaching, and a sorcerer by the name of Simon gets saved. And it says there that he gets saved. Later on, Simon sees the apostles lay hands upon people and they get baptized with the Holy Spirit, and [unintelligible]. Ask the apostle Peter if you give him money, if maybe you can get this power. And he approaches Peter. And this is what Peter says to him. He says, “Your heart is not right with God in this manner.” This is what Peter says. He says, “You need to repent of the wickedness of this thought and ask God to forgive you.” In addition to that, John, the apostle of love in 1 John 1:9 says, “If we confess our sins God is faithful and just to forgive us of our sins and to cleanse us from all that’s not righteous.” Now Sid, it has been said that 1 John was written to Gnostics, a people who taught false doctrine, but the letters were written to the church. John actually says, Sid, “My little children.” He said, “You spiritual fathers who know Jesus the Messiah, you young men who have the Word of God living in you, you’ve overcome the wicked one, you children, you spiritual children who know God, that’s who I’m writing to.” And so it is very clear that the Word of God teaches us, after we get saved we need to repent because repentance is the method that God uses to transform your mind and my mind so that we do the will of God in a way that’s acceptable, pleasing and honoring to him.

SID: Okay. Tony, what about someone says, are you saying to me, Tony, I have to be born again twice? Is that what you’re saying?

TONY: No, I’m not saying that. Here’s what is the truth. Jesus says to one of the churches in the Book of Revelation, “You were born again, but because you chose to sin you spiritually died.” And when a person repents they can spiritually come back to life.

SID: Some of the counterfeit grace teachers are teaching either there is no Hell or there’s something like a Purgatory, a short term Hell, and then you go to Heaven. What would you say to them?

TONY: Well I’m listening to the apostle of love, again, John, and he says in Revelation 14, and he also says in Revelation 20, “That the people who are not found in the Book of Eternal Life, those who have repented, believe and obey Jesus the Messiah, that they go to the Lake of Fire and they’re tormented there forever.”

SID: Now what is the Lake of Fire?

TONY: The Lake of Fire is Hell. It’s where everyone goes who does not obey Jesus to the end of their lives. And allow me to say this, too, Sid, I want to listen to Jesus, because Jesus said in Mark 9, and Jesus is speaking to his disciples. He said, “If a person dies in sin,” and Jesus actually says to the disciples, “If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. If your eye causes you to sin, cut that sin off. If your foot causes you to sin, cut it off.” Jesus said, “The person who dies in sin will go into the fire that never shall be quenched.”

SID: Why is Tony, why is he so passionate over this? Because the Bible says it. Why is he so passionate over this? Because he had a vision of the Lake of Fire. He had a vision of Hell. And I want him to tell us about that when we come back. Don’t go away.

Sid:  We want everyone everywhere to be red hot for the Messiah. By the time you’ve finish this weeks’ interview I’m going to tell you something they’ll be a paradigm change in your life.  It’s what you’ve always been after I can’t wait to get into it but my guest is Dennis Clark. Dennis and I were talking a little bit before we started this show and I want you to know a little bit about his background.  He’s watching TV one day a Christian TV show and he’s not born again, the last thing on his mind and  a preacher points his hand it’s as if it came right out of the screen it was just as if he was talking just to Dennis, and Dennis gets born again.  And he reads the Bible and he knows that this is God’s Word. He has no unusual supernatural things happen although it was very supernatural that just as TV evangelist just arrested his attention. Four months later he’s minding his own business and all of a sudden he has a vision.  No paradigm for supernatural, no one’s every told him anything about this, what did you see Dennis?

Dennis: In my minds’ eye I saw the Godhead, an understanding that was an impression on the inside.  Father, Son and Holy Spirit that I was indwelt and infused with a tremendous sense of power, then with my eyes wide open in the air in front of me were letters of living light.  Letters that I could read but when I read them I did not just read them with my mind.  My entire being was absorbing, and reading, and understanding the living words that I was seeing in front of my eyes.

Sid:  What did it say?

Dennis: It said, “Grand Book and Bible” a Christian Book Store within a mile of my house.

Sid: You don’t have to be a mental giant you get this amazing vision, you got to the book store and what happened?

Dennis: I was grabbed by the arm by one of the clerks she said “There is a man in this store that you must meet,” and took me over and the man was the author of the book that I had read, the only Christian book that I had read that four month period outside of the Bible.  And he said, “You need to go to a Christian businessman’s lunch.”

Sid:  This was what “Full Gospel Businessman.”

Dennis: Yes.

Sid: So you go to the meeting and all of a sudden you find out about being baptized in the Holy Spirit.  You receive the baptism you speak in a supernatural language; how did your life change?

Dennis: From that moment on there was always, and I mean always, a constant awareness of God’s presence.  There never was a moment that I wasn’t aware of precious cargo carrying precious cargo.  I even equated it kind of like a pregnant woman 7, 8, 9 months she has to be about her business but she will always be aware that she’s carrying precious cargo.  And the feelings never left, it was what I later come to understand of course the fruit of the Spirit the sense of His presence.

Sid:  You actually had a Spirit that had been harassing you your whole life broken off in 1976. You were afraid to even share your testimony in front of people.

Dennis: Yes.

Sid: Tell me what happened briefly.

Dennis: Well, I went and was invited because of the richness of even passing on the testimony of the open vision etcetera, they put me in front of a crowd of perhaps 40 people to share my testimony.  And for whatever reason out of the blue I’m standing on this platform and I freeze,  I mean just totally freeze. I could feel shame and it was strong and powerful and I didn’t understand it and walked right off the stage.

Sid:  You must have been even more humiliated by having to walk off the stage, you must have been a horrific experience for you.  Then what happened?

Dennis:  Absolutely, went home and then I went home and I said, “God, I’ve been called to preach, I’ve been having all these wonderful experiences what is wrong with me?”  And I knelt down by the side of a couch and I closed my eyes and it happened again. All of a sudden in my mines eyes with total clarity I saw myself at the age of perhaps nine and I was a bed wetter. I saw in my mind’s eye a young nine year old boy, me, making fists hating himself.  Hating himself that he couldn’t even control his own body. The shame was so powerful that it was my little secret nobody knew this.  And I said, “God, I knew that it was wrong to hold unforgiveness toward anybody but even myself.”  And down in my Spirit I received, this was even without words, I receive, this is even without words, “I receive forgiveness for having held such hatred for myself.”  And when I did I was flooded with the peace and all of sudden there was this thing that was on me like a slimy stocking mask, simultaneously while I felt, because I felt everything in the spirit realm as a constant, I felt it lift in my mind’s eye it was lifting off me, it was like a burglars stocking mask only it was slimy and ugly and as it came off…

Sid: You know what this reminds me it’s almost like you made an oath no one is going to ever know that I had this horrible habit and you even blocked it from yourself but you didn’t block it from your real self because it limited you from fulfilling your destiny.

Dennis:  Absolutely.

Sid:  And once it was lifted was it almost immediate that you had freedom?

Dennis: It was immediate as a matter of fact I went to a local church the next day and the first thing they said is “Dennis we want you to share your testimony.”  And the first thing I did was walked up to that pulpit and I said, “I don’t know if everyone is going to understand this but I like me,” and they all laughed about wow this guys may have some issues. I was so full of the joy of the Lord that I felt that for the first time I received myself the way God received me.

Sid: You were free.

Dennis: I was free, it was total freedom and shame and it was just like amazing that had been blocking the way.

Sid:  And the gifts of the Spirit ever since you were baptized in the Holy Spirit started flowing. Although you had a good prayer life at least you thought you had a good prayer life.  One day you are praying and you heard from God, what did He say to you?

Dennis: He said, “Ask me to teach you to pray.”  And at first I was a little stunned because I thought it was quite sufficient.  I mean I had learned everything I learned I learned in prayer and He said, “Ask me to teach you to pray.”  And so then I just humbled myself and said, “Sure, teach me how to pray.”  And then to my surprise it started immediately that day, one thought coming from the heart of God bombarding me continuously, and it must have lasted for a month.  That thought was “Dennis, I’m giving you My undivided attention.”  And every single day He never changed the subject but I like soaked in it, I absorbed it and I wanted to be a partaker of that.  And little did I know only in hindsight that rejection was being washed out of me over a period of five weeks, but in the mean time it did something else that I thought was quite amazing.  While I had never known such acceptance I had never known such affection, I had never and I’m feeling these things, they were not thoughts or concepts they were impressions that I owned and I absorbed and then as I…

Sid: These were knew feelings.

Dennis: These were totally – I never had anything like this I mean I was Dennis the Menace, there was nobody saying “Dennis you know your might constant delight and I’m giving you my undivided attention.”  But what happened was that all of a sudden by the end of the four weeks, being bombarded with so much affection, acceptance, attention I wanted to burst inside and say “God I want to reciprocate, I’ve got to, I can’t do like you God I can’t think of you every minute every hour.  I’ll try but I can’t do it like you, but oh God that I could reciprocate.” That’s when the voice came and He said, “You can, I’ve given you the equipment.”

Sid: What you know, and then for the next month God’s spoke to Dennis and taught him step by step… You know what it reminds me, when I was a young believer Dennis I got a hold of a book by Brother Lawrence and it was called “The Practice of the Presence of God.” This was written in the 1617 hundreds. It was a monk that his job in the monastery was washing dishes, but he had such communion with God that he was happier than if he had been President of the United States, well, that’s not a good analogy.  Well, leave that one alone, but people would seek him out because they knew when they would meet him they’d come and they’d come into the presence of God.  Well, I read that book and I tried to do what that book said, but it didn’t work for me, and that’s why I’m so excited about interviewing you because Dennis for the next 30 days God said to you “I’m giving you my undivided attention and I’m going to teach you how to commune with me.”

Sid:  I have on the telephone Peggy Joyce Ruth, I’m speaking to her at her home in Brownwood, Texas and Peggy Joyce was a born again Christian and she decided she’d witness to her Buddhist neighbor. And Peggy Joyce you had no idea on the rollercoaster ride that you were about ready to get on to.  At your worst as a result of opening yourself up to those tormenting spirits what position did you find yourself in?

Peggy: Well, it was very tormenting, I found myself finally under the care of a number of different psychiatrists, I was given shock treatments over a period of a lot of months.

Sid: If you didn’t have a problem the shock treatments would have given you one.

Peggy: So true, yes that is so true.  They put me on medication and said “I would be on medication the rest of my life and didn’t really expect that I would ever stay out of a mental institution because I was so filled with all kinds of fear.  And you know some of the biggest fears were disease and accidents and tragedy it just seemed like that opened me up to just living in torment.

Sid:  And you even started doing a search of different religions, but you finally came to the end of your rope; you finally gave up and you cried a prayer to God.  What was that prayer?

Peggy: I finally one night…it had been eight years and I had tried everything on my own I did the best that I could do and I went out to the clothes line and I said, “God I don’t even know any more if You even exist I can’t my prayers don’t even seem like they would get past the ceiling but if you’re there find me and bring me back to You.”  And I didn’t know it at the time but as I looked back in retrospect God started immediately to work on that prayer request and my goodness I just look back and see just the beautiful hand of God.

Sid: Well, as I’m looking over my notes on what God did it’s only and I’m looking at it almost as the eyes of a teacher which you happen to be also.  And the first thing that happened to you is that you prayed.  The second thing is you were baptized of the Holy Spirit speaking in unknown tongues but that wasn’t enough because you were still deficient in some areas so God gave you a vision and as a result of this vision you went through deliverance so step one was being filled with the Holy Spirit, step two was deliverance but it didn’t really happen till step three.  What was step three?

Peggy: Step three God had given me that vision and the first part of it showed me deliverance which I had no idea what that meant until after the fact.  But then the second part of the vision was how He was going to pack me.  Fill all the holes in that were in my body and that was the period where he was packing me with the Word and He gave me an exchange system.  He said that every time I had a fear thought, every time that I had any kind of terror or torment of any kind I was to exchange that for a thought from His Word, from a promise from His Word.  And I did that and it was over a period of oh weeks that I just did that all the time I would just constantly…

Sid:  You know what excites me is that in this dream that you had you heard a scripture, the scripture you had never heard of before and the scripture was “In your day of trouble call on Me and I will answer.”  There could not have been a more appropriate scripture for you in the entire Bible.

Peggy: It was, I was out in the field in the dream and when I heard that scripture it was like I was so excited it was like I could just feel my whole body just responding and praising and it wasn’t until the next day that the Lord supernaturally showed me where that scripture came from, I had no idea, I didn’t know the word 30 years ago and I had no idea that that was coming out of 91.  And when I found Psalm 91 I knew that even before I turned to it I knew that whatever was in that Psalm I knew was my answer.  And sure enough when I got there every fear that I ever had was answered in that Psalm, because protection promises are all through the word of God but this is the only place where every protection promise is there in that one covenant.

Sid:  It’s all summarized.

Peggy: Yes, exactly and every evil known to man is going to fall under one of four categories and all four categories are listed there in Psalm 91 with a promise that if we’ll dwell in His shelter; if we’ll acknowledge and look to Him as our protector then that evil will not approach us.  Then He goes one to tell us in that Psalm that He’s given us authority over the enemy.  He goes on to tell us that He’s given us his angels that will protect us.  And then seven more bonus promises at the end for those that love Him will extend their love to Him.  And oh, I just can’t even tell you what that did for me and God had me study that for months and months every word in that Psalm.  And of course I had no idea that He was having me do it to someday teach it to others I just thought he was doing that to bring me back to life.

Sid:  Isn’t it amazing that you can mediate and study one Psalm in the Bible which summarizes every problem that a person could have come against them from disasters, hurricanes, tornadoes, terrorist attacks, physical illness, infirmities of all kind, fears of all kind, emotional problems of all kind but you would think after thirty years you’d be I have to say this, you’d be bored with the 91^st Psalm.

Peggy: I see something new and hear new testimonies every single day, I wake up in the mornings and every time I confess this Psalm over me and over my family and over my church and different places, it’s like I’m confessing for the first time it is so exciting.  But God’s word is, it’s new every morning.

Sid: Well, the reason that I’m interviewing you is that I have two brand new books, one is literally off the press and the one that I’m holding in my hands right now it’s what is called the board book for children say 1 to 8 years of age and it’s the 91^st Psalm.  And the thing that I find so unusual about this book is that yes the parents could read it to the child or the child could read it for themselves.  But the child could figure out this thing just from the illustrations; was that intentional?

Peggy: Oh, yes that was my prayer.  I had had so many parents that were asking for a Psalm 91 book that they could teach the Psalm 91 to their children.  And we were constantly telling parents you know “Confess your covenant over your children.”  But I had never read anything teaching the child himself to learn how to appropriate these promises. And you know mom and dad is not always going to be there, so we have to get that child to the point where this becomes his revelation as well.

Sid:  And then your second book which is Psalm 91 for youth which is 8 to actually any age this is literally just off the press.  This I know that I’m talking to grandparents and parents and even young people right now. Just whet my appetite with one quick testimony of someone that took Psalm 91 and it literally saved their life.

Peggy:  Yes, oh I have so many wonderful testimonies I get so excited about that because we have been teaching this in our church now for 25–30 years so I’ve been teaching it even on a local radio program.  And so the people have really grabbed hold of it and our college students we’ve sent about 25 of our college team over to a Myan village in Mexico and every day they were getting up and they were confessing Psalm 91 over their team.  And they had Spanish interpreters but they didn’t have anyone who could interpret the Myan language for them.  And so they were taken one of the days up to this beautiful waterfalls way up in the mountains and at the bottom of the falls there was a glorious pond and was really hot over there and so they just couldn’t resist all going swimming with them.  Well, the next year when they came back there was a Myan guide who told them “Now you must not go to the pond at the bottom of the waterfalls because it’s full of very dangerous alligators.”  And so they realized that they had been swimming the year before with gators.  So they found out that the people had been so impressed the year before at these American’s who could swim with the alligators you know that it gave them to testify about a God who protects.  And you know we all thanked God that he could protect by shutting the mouths of the alligators just as easily as he shut the mouths of the lions in Daniels day.

Sid: Peggy Joyce if you had had a background like this as a child or a teenager; if you had had a teaching in a study like the two books we’re making available do you think you would have had to go through all the hell that you went through in this life?

Peggy: I wouldn’t, that’s what my husband and I talk all the time about the fact that we are so excited to be able to plant this inside of our grandchildren and our great-grandchildren.

Sid:  You know there are so much evil in this earth today there’s so much going on with children and sexual predators and terrorists and boy to denude these children of fear and move them into intimacy with God.

Peggy: Exactly.

Sid: What a gift for a parent or a grandparent to give their children.

Sid:  We’re getting ready Mishpochah to have the greatest Open Heaven the world has ever experienced and the Glory of God is going to come on us and when we speak we won’t have to confess, confess, confess, confess and believe and believe and believe because when God’s Glory shows up everything is instant.  And I have David Hertzog on the telephone and I’m interviewing him this week on his brand new book that’s just off the press “Glory Invasion.”  David in the book you said that you always knew if you could understand about how God created everything out of nothing it would be a key to what God wanted you to do and accomplish in your life.  It would be a key for you to understand all of how God’s faith dimension operates, explain.

David: Well, Hebrews 11:1 alludes to the fact that God created everything visible out of things invisible.  I was taught God created everything out of nothing.  And I always knew what if I could figure out how God could create something out of nothing then I could see incredible things happen that would just boggle the mind for the Lord.  And I caught a hold of Hebrews 11:1, wait a second He didn’t create everything out of nothing as I was taught in Sunday School, He created everything visible out of things invisible.  So I thought what are those invisible things that He used to create visible things, but they’re real things.  Genesis 1 it talks about the Spirit of God or the Glory or the presence or whatever you want to call it.  Hovering that’s invisible, most people most of the time you can’t see those we did in Miracle Valley, most of the time you can’t see the presence of God or the Glory you can sense it.  And the second thing was sound; He said “Let there be light.”  You can’t see sound but it’s a real thing even scientists know sounds exist and I just started getting this revelation about sound and the Glory of God that when the two merge together those two invisible ingredients it creates visible.  “Let there be light,” the Holy Spirit or the Spirit was hovering, God spoke and there was light and I started operating more and more in this realm of creative miracles from the invisible realm to the visible realm where you see a body part or you see something in the Spirit but then as you speak it out when the Glory’s heavy things are created it’s really really exciting.

Sid: You talk about literally science has even proven that the law of gravity can be suspended, what do you mean by that?

David: The smallest particle known to man; I’ll start with that and then I’ll have to explain your question; is a sound wave.  They usually thought it was a proton or a neutron and atom and now they’re saying even in quantum physics if you break down the smallest particle known to man it’s not even a proton, neutron, or an atom it’s sound, it’s sound vibration is the smallest building block of every atom, proton, neutron.  And that sound wave has ability to hear and respond which they’re founding out and so knowing that that the creation can hear and respond is created from sound then it’s a whole different element then you understand why Jesus spoke to the wind and waves and they obeyed Him, not just the demons the actual creation obeying His voice.  Why God told Moses to speak to the rock not just hit the rock, why Jesus had a conversation with a tree and got angry at the fig tree for not producing, how Elijah just commanded rain to come it’s a whole different aspect that when you understand the creation and what makes it tick and how it responds to then you start understanding now you have authority over even gravity or time or being transported.  Do you get the idea?

Sid:  I understand well, let’s take one of the chapters of your book, “Extreme Governmental Glory,” how does this principal operate in the realm of governments and leaders?

David: When you’re in the Glory of God there’s like I said it’s like Heaven on Earth and whatever you speak during that time what God tells you to say this or say that, it’s not like I’m confessing something to happen it’s boom it’s happening as you speak.  So I’ll give you an example I was on my way to Africa to do a big big evangelistic campaign and I’m in the plane and the Lord tells me the Glory comes upon me really strong and the Lord says to me “I want you to speak to the government.”  And I said, “How am I going to do that?”  He says “By speaking it right now in the airplane because My Glory is here right now whatever you speak right now is going to happen.”  It’s like strike the ground seven times right now and as many times as you strike it at this time right now you’ll have victory.  So I spoke it out loud I said, “In the Name of Jesus government open up right now to the Glory of God.”  As soon as I arrived the Pastor said “Is there anything I can do for you, here’s your hotel, here’s some food, get ready for the meetings tonight.  And then I said, “Yes I liked to speak to the government” and he looked at me really shocked so I didn’t push this subject; a few days later he calls me up and says, “I know it’s your night off but get dressed in two hours we’re going to the Vice President’s house, I hope you have a prophetic word for him.”  And I said, “What, how did this happen?”  He says “Don’t ask me,” I said, “No, tell me.”  He said, “Well, I told him you had a major prophetic word that was going to shake his life so he better listen to it.”  And he says, “You have a word don’t you?”  I said, “No, I didn’t think about what I was going to say if it happened.”  And so I had two hours to ask God for this man and I was nervous and I said, “God help me.”  And to make a long story short I got into his house into his living room began prophesying him and his wife began to weep like babies, anyways it’s a long story but God really changed his life and God invaded that man and the vice president of a country just by operating in the Glory.

Sid: Help me understand how would you define experientially the difference you said “When the Glory comes in you know that you can pronounce what God is showing you and it’s going to instantly happen.”  How do you know the difference between the glory and just a heavy anointing?

David: The difference is this, many times you’ll be in a meeting if you go to a lot of peoples’ meetings and they say revival meeting or healing meeting or whatever so you go and you don’t sense anything in the room special but obviously the man is preaching, he’s operating and he says okay we’re going to have a healing line for instance.  So you go up or you don’t even go up you watch others and say “Oh wow I think I’ve been healed praise God.”  So the gifts are operating but you’re not sensing the presence of the Glory in the entire room.  It may be on that one man preaching maybe, or it can just be anointing but it’s not in the entire atmosphere.  When the Glory comes in usually you sense it in the entire atmosphere as opposed to just inside the man of God.

Sid:  Well, you know what that’ll do it’s take the emphasis off the man and put it on God.

David: Exactly.

Sid: I like that idea!

David: Exactly and it makes your job easier because they’re not all looking to you to make it happen, they might be looking to you but you’re looking to God and God’s stretching out His hand.

Sid:  Now something you talk about in your book and you talk about wherever I hear you speak is the connection of Israel, and revival and signs and wonders, and even birthing your ministry.  Talk a little about that.

David: Sure, well in Roman’s 11 it talks about Israel or the Jewish people coming back into the gospel in a big way I mean there has always been Jewish people saved and they’re the first ones who brought salvation.  But it talks about in the last days when Israel comes back in it talks about a world revival.  So I got a hold of that scripture one day I was just asking God about my ministry Lord “What do You want me to do, how am I going to win the world.” When I was a missionary overseas to Europe and I just kind of struggling “Lord, what’s the key, what’s the secret if you can tell me one thing what would this key be for my ministry to win Europe and the world and America?”  And He said to me, “Bless Israel towards salvation and all I’ll bless any other nation that you put your hand to.”  And so that was a huge, huge, huge revelation for me and I was surprised that nobody else understood this revelation, pastors at the time this was years ago and I said, “Gosh, how come no one gets it?”  And they wouldn’t really, and I realized it was just a revelation that I had gotten from God.  Here I’ll just read the scriptures it says “If they’re stumbling has been blessing for the world and their failure rich for the Gentiles think what an enrichment or a great advantage will fall they’re full reinstatement.”  So it’s talking like why if they for a season some of the religious leaders missed Yeshua and God allowed Gentiles to have salvation, if they missed it we got this blessed, the church “How much more if they come back in; it’ll be as life from the dead or resurrection.”  And so that’s why I talk about Resurrection Glory in the sense of when Israel comes back into the gospel it’ll cause a new worldwide revival.  So when our ministry we always made a point to bless Israel, pray for Israel salvation, give towards ministries that are reaching out to the Jewish people or Israel and go to Israel and be a witness.

Sid: And you’re not you would not even want me to say this, but I was very impressed when we first met you started you and your wife started sowing into our ministry.

David: Well, we love your ministry you’re one of the few that are reaching lots of Jewish people with not just the gospel but with signs and wonders, or showing the supernatural part of God which is what you know the Bible says the Jews seek a sign.  So that’s why we like supporting you because you’re reaching them with signs showing that God’s a God of power not just a God of His Word.

Sid:  If people only understood there is such a key but I just love your book, where did you first start understanding the Glory because candidly David most Christians don’t have a clue; when you hear the Glory you hear it’s a word.

David: Yeah, I first… God began speaking to me about the Glory so I thought I had the Glory but I didn’t really fully operate in it.  I was doing a six month revival preaching on the Glory and actually that was one of the main messages and this revival broke out.  But then in 1999 of January the 2^nd I met Ruth Heflin she was a woman of God, very prophetic and she was probably the woman of God that was…I would call her an apostle of the Glory I mean she understood, she lived the Glory, she taught this revelation and just in my encounters with meeting her and being around her and having her invite me that’s really when this new Glory as we call it came upon my ministry through Ruth Heflin.

Sid: When you are in the Glory and you talk about it in your book all the things that happened you talk about deliverance is so much easier in the Glory, explain.

David: Oh, it’s so fun well if you’ve ever done deliverance you know how it can be where you’re praying for somebody maybe you’re trying to find the roots, and how did this demon get in here, were you abused, you can almost go though like a checklist like at a doctor’s office you know sign this release form and then we’ll…but then when the Glory begins to come suddenly it’s easy, you know.  Normally a lot of people shy away from deliverance because it sounds like demons and throwing up and screaming and all this kind and then the Glory sounds like “Awe the Heavenly realm and angels singing.”  So I always thought how do you merge the two together there’s got to be a way and I was in Africa one night preaching…

Sid:  I’ll tell you what, hold that thought we’ll find out about Africa on tomorrow’s broadcast.

Sid: My guest is red hot for the Messiah his name is Al Houghton, I’m speaking to him at Anaheim, California. Al has just written a brand new book it’s called “The Sure Mercies of David” and it’s really not new but it is new to this generation of Christians;  the first church understood it.  Al you said to me before we went on the air that the gospel that is currently being preached is only half of the picture.What did you mean by that?

Al:Sid, what I mean by that was the gospel of Christ is covenantal Jesus came not only as Savior and that’s what the gospel is.  Matthew, Mark, Luke and John paint a picture of Jesus the Savior; now when I went to seminary, got through Bible school that’s all I learned I learned that Jesus of the gospels.  But when I got in ministry the Lord Himself began to introduce me, well actually the way I got in ministry Sid was I met Jesus the Judge, Jesus the Judge is in Revelation.

Sid:You know I have to reflect a little bit, I was in a horrible mess 35 years ago and as a Jewish person involved in the New Age I had never heard anything about repentance.  I knew nothing about repentance. I was told the name of Jesus was higher than the demons that were literally possessing me and trying to kill me. I cried out one day “Jesus help” and I was set free.  Look at the mercy of God, but I knew nothing about repentance until years later.

Al:  That’s awesome, that is deliverance in the Name of Jesus, that’s Jesus in the gospels the deliverer, the healer, the savior.  I tried to argue with God; He was dealing with me to come into the ministry Sid and I said.”Lord I volunteered for a second tour in Vietnam so I could get enough hours to become and airline pilot, okay I laid down that career, but just let me go get my airline transport rating it’s a PhD in aviation that’ll cap off I’ll be able to lay it down then, just let me go do that.Silence.  I went to Olathe, Kansas to take my ATR check ride and you get in a brief oral, I walked in there Sid God took my mind away, I didn’t know who I was, I didn’t know where I’d…

Sid:It reminds me of a professional golfer that went into a tournament, he was called into ministry, he said, “No” to God, he forgot how to swing the club.”

Al:  (Laughing)

Sid:Same deal.

Al:  It was the same deal, I didn’t…I couldn’t put two words together in a sentence. I didn’t know what a WAC chart was it was like a road map for the air.  I could not identify it.  My mind was totally gone, and the FAA instructor asked me three questions, he got mad, upset and he said, “Get the heck out of here and don’t ever come back here until you know the basics!”  I walked out the door totally humiliated as soon as the door closed I heard the Lord “Are you ready to obey now?”

Sid:Hmm.

Al:I said, “Yes, I guess I am.”  (Laughing)  And I forgot that Sid I forgot it through seminary, I forgot it through 7 years of ministry and I focused just on the promise and the blessing and I taught people how to pursue anything they want through covenant and blessing.  And then again I met Jesus the judge, and all of a sudden I started to look at the difference between Jesus in the gospels and Jesus in the book of Revelation.  And Jesus in the gospels stilled the storm, He said, “Peace be still.”  But in Revelation chapter 2 to one of the churches He said, “If you don’t repent I will send a storm, I will send tribulation.”  In John 10:10 “The thief cometh not but to steal, kill and destroy, I came that you might have life and have it more abundantly.”  The devil called a thief there but to the church of Sardis in Revelation 3 verse 3 Jesus said “If you don’t repent I will come to you as a thief.”  So Jesus as both Savior and Judge is what the early church manifest to overcome the opposition and accomplish their assignments.  And I woke up to the fact that I didn’t know Jesus the Judge.We weren’t teaching Jesus the Judge, we had no paradigm for Jesus the judge and we had no access his justice.  So when I talk about Jesus the judge I’m really talking about divine justice.  God is a God of justice and we have a covenant that allows us to go into his throne room and pray and ask Him for justice. And He will stand up at that moment on our behalf and His justice will come; and I had never seen that, I had never taught that, but when I found it lights went off.  I said, “God this is covenant of David Jesus bought and paid for it, Paul had a revelation of it.  He took it too Antioch, I’m convinced the reason they’re fist called Christians in Antioch is because this covenant of sure mercy that says two things.  Number one I will redeem your failure and make it a platform for your greatest success.Number two, I give you access to the throne to bring divine justice into the earth.

Sid:Why is it that this generation hasn’t even heard of it and as a matter of fact if you talk about God’s judgment people get really upset with you and they say “No no these earthquakes and tornadoes and tsunami, that’s not judgment, that’s just the natural decay of the whole earth.  It’s global warming.

Al:  (Laughing)

Sid:I mean and I don’t want to get into the political ramifications but the church is very upset unless God is a sugar daddy and God would never usher in this kind of judgment.

Al:  This comes Sid really from the last 50 years of simply majoring on one part of scripture and that is the gospels to the exclusions of the rest of the Bible.  Even in the New Testament we see Jesus the judge now the fruit of this preaching for 40 years is now we have a church who only knows half of Jesus.  They know Jesus the Savior, they do not know Jesus the judge and we in the fruit of that now for 30 years has been one loss of Christian freedom after another.  When I was a teenager in high school there was prayer before we started every English class, there was prayer before every football game, there was prayer before every assembly.We have lost that right.  When I was in high school we had the Ten Commandments on the Wall, we have lost that right.  We have lost freedom, after freedom after freedom, after freedom.

Sid:What about just the one major sin of abortion, of murder of the innocent?

Al:  The cry, the innocent blood has a cry before the throne and what it cries for is judgment.

Sid:What about… isn’t it true that the last thing that happens to a society before it totally decays and dissolves is homosexuality is on the forefront?

Al:  That is absolutely true and we find it in two places in the scripture.We find it in Leviticus chapter 20 where it gives us a 4 step slide to the loss of a nation in judgment.Number one the first thing in Leviticus chapter 20 is the sacrifice of innocent blood; our children that are lost. And then it goes into witchcraft, New Age, and then the fourth one is the statutorily protection of homosexuality and lesbianism.

Sid:Well if the church continues on its path of just half of the gospel and not the justice of God, what is your prognosis for the United States of America? I can tell you this, with my own eyes in my life time I’ve never seen things turning so rapidly to sin.

Al:  Absolutely, my prognosis is this is based on Leviticus 20 it says that “If we statutorily protect what God hates, if we change our laws.”  Alright there are three barriers to the loss of the land Sid, number one barrier is the conscience of the individual, when an individual sears his conscience then the second one kicks in and that is the corporate conscience of society which are the laws of the land.  Whenever the laws of the land are changed to promote and reflect what God hates you got a third and final opportunity to save the land and that is the church.But when the church begins to ordain homosexual bishops now you’re down to a covenant prophetic remnant and they are the last chance for that nation.  And the only thing we have at this point to use and it’s enough Sid and that is an appeal to the justice of God based on the covenant of sure mercy; have mercy on the nation and bring your justice on the offending parties.  Now that’s the only way to save it.

Sid:Al I’m sorry time is slipping away…

Sid: My guest Steve Hill yields himself as much as he possibly can to the Spirit of the Living God and sees the same results happen when he speaks as we read in the New Testament, that is normal.  And he is on a campaign to make Christians normal. I’m featuring his latest book “Operating in the Miraculous” and you can see God’s hand on his life and on his family’s life of how step by step He taught him on one of the greatest generation the Argentina.  Miracles like… is it true Steve you were telling me that one of the people that you were working with or observing was Carlos Annacondia outside this gigantic tent even coming in and start manifesting demons because of the anointing of God was so strong?

Steve: Oh absolutely Sid we call that the demon tent and for a lack of a better term you know because you know it was people would be so delivered by the power of God. In Argentina and also in the U.S. there’s a lot of cultic activity there’s a lot of witchcraft and people would be mightily delivered when they’re confronted by the power of the gospel, when they’re confronted by Jesus there is power in the Name of Jesus.  You know you can say Baptist, you can say Methodist, you can say Assembly of God, you can shout out Sid Roth or Steve Hill and nothing happens, but when you call out the Name Jesus I want to tell you all Hell itself trembles.

Sid:  Now in Pensacola, Florida at the Brownsville revival with so many people just coming from all over the world. and you were the lightning rod that God used on Father’s Day 1995 almost a half million people made professions of faith and so many miracles and deliverances.  Did you have witches actually come in and try and stop this move of God?

Steve: Many, many, many, many, many, many times and there’s one particular time that a host of them came from New Orleans because we’re only three hours from New Orleans.  And this group came over and sat in the back row and they had their little rattles and they sat there and they were chanting in the back row.  And you know I welcome them, okay I stood and I told everybody welcome everyone to the revival and if you’re come here and maybe you’re a witch or a warlock and you’ve come to chant against us we welcome you and we don’t mind you chanting just keep your chanting down low as not to disturb the people around you.  And…

Sid: And my goodness Steve you got chutzpah, that’s a Hebrew word and it means nerve, okay go ahead.

Steve: Then I said this I said, “But let me remind you that you’re wasting your time because the power of Jesus Christ is that’s in this room is more powerful than anyone you’re chanting to so in the Name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth we pray, we bind you.  And we’ve seen so many witches delivered, we’ve seen so many people set free. You know you’re bringing up a subject right here that is real pet peeve of mine and that’s how Christians are afraid for some reason they are afraid of the occult, they are afraid of witches and warlocks and you know they see some kid at the mall all dressed up in black and wearing a pentagram and they’re afraid.  My friend we have, we’re covered in the blood, we have total authority over every other power that’s out there; walk right up to the people you can have a conversation with them.  Say the Name Jesus and watch what happens. (Laughing)

Sid:  Steve you’re like the Bible speaks about, you’re a dead man that was given your life back, you should have died from drug overdose and crime and a whole slew of things before you got saved.  Then after you were saved you picked up an incurable disease hepatitis; when you found out you have that disease it’s a death sentence what did you do?

Steve: Well, it is a death sentence and it was killing a lot of my friends and it’s killing a lot of people today.  Well, I wasn’t happy when I heard about it you know the doctor said that’s “It’s incurable, he said that “There’s one medication you can take and there is only a 5% cure and it’s got really bad side effects.”  So I decided well God’s going to have to heal me; it’s funny I went home and told my wife, I told her I said, “I’m going to die.”  And of course I look forward to death okay, when death comes I get to go with Jesus so I have no fear of death, I want to live long don’t get me wrong but I have no fear of death.  And she said, “You’re not going anywhere, she said, “You’re not leaving me here with all the kids.”  And so she just…

Sid: (laughing)

Steve: She was straight man and so that night I went to the revival and Suzette Hadding who had worked with Reinhardt Bonnke for years she was visiting and she had a word from the Lord that I had an incurable disease.

Sid:  Did she have any way of knowing this in the natural?

Steve: Oh, no one knew, no one knew outside of my wife and my doctor, because I had just been diagnosed.  And then she prayed a prayer she said, “God’s going to heal you.”  Instantly right after the prayer the next day went back to the doctor, had more blood work couldn’t find it.  God more blood work, couldn’t find it.  And you know Sid, all that we’re talking about is the Bible says in Mark 16:17 “That these signs will follow those who believe.” You know verse 18 says “They’ll lay hands on the sick and they will recover.” If you’re a believer these things should be happening.

Sid: Okay, you’ve had so much experience in the Argentinean Revival, Brownsville and Pensacola, Florida I mean from two different major revivals you’ve had this experience you’ve written what you’ve learned. But most people would say “Yes Steve but we know the anointing that you walk under, I’ve seen you at Brownsville, I’ve seen you on television, I’ve seen people just fall over when you walk by them that’s not me; so this is going to work for me.  What would you say to them?”

Steve: Well, take your pick, “What do you want, okay.”  I want the power of God and this is not, God is no respecter of persons if you’re living holy, you love the Lord with all your heart, soul and strength.  He wants to use you sister, sir, he wants to use you but you’ve got to choose to be chosen.  And you say “Lord use me.”  And then one of the reasons I want to encourage people to get this little manual to me is all it is this “Operating in the Miraculous.”  Because I tell people what the steps to take, I try to make it easy to understand that it’s not you, you’re not…Steve Hill is nobody.  I’m a you know I’m a drug addict saved by grace, but as I follow the Biblical patterns for miracles then they’re going to happen.  See it’s not up to me, it’s up to God, He’s the one that’s on the spot, not Steve Hill.  Because He says “He will heal.”  So we need to know what to do and how to do it and watch what God does.

Sid:  You know what would you say to a mother listening right now whose kids are on drugs, one raised as Christians and there out there selling their bodies.  They’re alcoholics and you know it’s very few of these people get healed through science.

Steve: What I would say is never stop knocking, never stop asking, never stop praying and one of the things that moms and dads forget about if that we live in this…our own little world but we forget that there’s angels, this is a spiritual warfare and if your son or daughter has left home or your son or daughter is in another area or family member that’s sick or lost or on drugs.  Remember God has got warring angels he has got men and women that are outside of your world.  My mom did not lead me to Jesus, another man led me to Jesus but my mom was the one praying and so believe God for the miraculous, step outside of your little world and say God whatever it takes touch my loved one.

Sid: Steve I got to ask you this question, when you were through a word of knowledge you were prayed for; you were healed of an incurable disease hepatitis did you go back to the doctor that gave you the death sentence and what did he say?

Steve: Well, I had to yeah because you know I want to see the paper, and on top of that I was trying to get some life insurance so I need, and they’re not going to give me anybody life insurance that’s about to croak.  And so I went back had the blood tests and all clear and went back again and had it clear and several months, I mean I’ve had blood tests for the last several years and there is just no sign, as a matter of fact I had one two days ago.  No sign of it and so Jesus heals, oh Jesus right now in Jesus Name for those that are listening that need a fresh touch from God in Jesus Name I speak healing on your body, I speak healing on that neck, I speak healing that arthritis, that arthritic hand in Jesus Name be healed.  That heart be healed in Jesus Name.

Sid:  I tell you what’s interesting Mishpochah how about a second witness as Steve was calling these words out he was calling them as I was hearing them also.  I know that you’re healed just proceed by moving your body and you’ll see, you’ll see that anointing.  What if someone moves there body and the pain is still there, what would you tell them to do?

Steve: First of all say the Name  Jesus, oh that…whatever you do don’t stop saying the Name of Jesus and say Jesus I’m healed, Jesus I’m healed, Jesus I’m healed and keep trying to move.  You know don’t do anything ridiculous you know it you’re in a wheelchair don’t wheel up to a stair well and throw yourself down but start moving around doing things you haven’t.  Be stubborn, oh please be stubborn about this go after God with all your heart soul and strength.

Sid: You know I’m reminded of someone that had hepatitis and had a death sentence and as a young man and as young children and a wife and a family and everything to live for and his ministry is prospering but as far as you’re concerned you got so desperate that’s how desperate we’re to be normally whether we have a death sentence of not.  That’s the normal way to fight, be a fighter don’t be a quitter, and some of you need a real shot in the arm on understanding of the lessons that Steve has learned over the years in miraculous.