Sid Roth

Sid:  This week I have been sharing my testimony. Why? Because we are on the edge of the greatest move of God’s Spirit in history that will start with the Jewish people, then spread to all people just as the first church started with the Jew and then spread to all people.  The greatest move of God’s Spirit for evangelism in the history of this earth; the greatest move of signs and wonders. Why? Again to reach the Jew, the Bible says “The Jew requires a sign.”

So boy was I messed up. As a matter of fact, I had people who read my testimony book and they say “Sid were you really this bad?” Some people don’t even like me after they read it. I felt I had a prophetic dream and God told me I must write my testimony book exactly the way it happened because I don’t have a problem with it because that person doesn’t live anymore; I’m a new creation, a new species, and if you didn’t know how bad I was then you couldn’t tell the difference. That’s why God had me write this, but more important He had me write this book so that you will understand the average American Jewish person you’re shortly going to bump into that is desperate to know Jesus. I tell you I proclaim that that average American Jewish person is desperate to know Jesus, but you don’t know this because you’re not opening your mouth and allowing God to fill it.

Well God is going to do a move of His Spirit on Jewish people but there are going to be asking questions and you must have good answers. This book has questions and answers but just by reading the story then give it to a Jewish person that God Himself is going to have cross your path.

On yesterday’s broadcast you found out that I was involved in the New Age and I was coming apart at the seams. Remember when I told you as a young kid I had this experience about death and it was so objectionable I blocked it from my mind? Well life was more difficult than that objectionable thing called death. I mean I reached my point, I go involved in this astral projection where your spirit leaves its body and you think this was… I was just going slightly nuts. Well, I was going just slightly nuts but it’s real. Duke University has a school of parapsychology, many colleges do. The Russians have been doing this for years.

I can tell you my spirit would leave my body and when this would happen this is the thought that I had. One I’ll go to sleep my spirit will leave my body and won’t make it back in time. If you’ve ever seen these Rod Serling science-fiction stories I have a plot that is so horrible you could put it together. Just in case there are young people listening I’m not going to explain it, but I had so much fear I was afraid to live, I was afraid to die.

My wife by the way was raised in a Christian home, they weren’t practicing at all they didn’t go to church. Their father was actually an atheist, her mother was a Christian. They shipped her off to church, they did not go themselves, but they shipped her off. This one day she walked down the aisle and became a believer in Jesus. When she got college she wasn’t prepared for her atheistic professors. She said “I wouldn’t become an atheist just in case there’s a God but I became an agnostic.”

When we got married I insisted that she convert to Judaism, she didn’t want to but I insisted. So she converted to Judaism. So you might say she was a Southern Baptist, agnostic, Orthodox Jew, she really was.

So worse day in my life I didn’t care whether I lived or died. I went out to a Jewish bookstore I bought a mezuzah, you see mezuzahs sometimes on Jewish doorposts they have scripture inside of them. I put it around my neck, I had a Bible at that time and I put it under my pillow. I was convinced I was involved with the devil himself, that I had opened myself up to the New Age. There was no where I could go for help, I couldn’t go to my parents who would give their life for me. They’d send me to psychiatrists one of the highest instances of suicide is among psychiatrists in this country. So they’re really going to help me? No! My problem was spiritual, it wasn’t mental or emotional, I had a demon inside of me and I need it out.

So by that point someone had given me a little booklet called the 4 Spiritual Laws, and I read these and I confessed my sins and I made Jesus my Lord, and nothing happened. So I didn’t even tell the guy that gave me the book, but I figured it didn’t work because in the New Age I had all sorts of feelings and experiences. But I had said that prayer then that night, the worst night of my life, I’m afraid my spirit’s going to leave my body and I’m going to be buried alive, awful thoughts going through my mind. So I said a 2 word prayer, but before I prayed that prayer I called my wife Joy. Remember I had been separated for a year, and I said “Joy it’s bad please pray for me.” She said “I will.”  I hung up, she hung up, I said a 2 word prayer “Jesus help.” That was it I went to sleep, I didn’t have a dream, had that in the New Age. I didn’t have a vision, had that in the New Age, and God has all of these things authentically in Christianity. He gave me something I never had in the New Age that fear that was encrusting me that was so tangible I could cut it with a knife. The phone would ring I could remember today even when it would ring I would just shake I was so nervous when the phone would ring.

I didn’t want to live, I didn’t want to die I was in awful shape, I just wanted out! I didn’t want Jesus but I was told that His power was greater than the power that I was involved in, and I was willing to try anything. Even coming from a Jewish Orthodox background and I said “Jesus help.”

I went to sleep that night not caring whether I lived or died and when I woke up in the morning, I tell you the evil within me was gone. As I was encrusted in fear, I was encased in liquid love. I had never felt such a feeling of peace in my entire life, and don’t ask me how I knew this but I knew that Jesus was responsible and I was very grateful. Then I heard the voice of God for the first time in my life that I knew it was God. He said “Return to your wife and daughter.” I returned and Joy and I celebrated our 39^th wedding anniversary. My daughter is married to a believer, she’s a believer. My father, my mother, my Jewish sister, my Jewish brother in law all believers. God is so good!

I’ll tell you something, I started reading the Bible for myself and I found such evidence, even that 18^th chapter of Deuteronomy that I read. It says in that same chapter, remember where it talks about the New Age is an abomination? It says in that same 18^th chapter the 18^th verse “The Lord said to me “What they have spoken is good.” Then God said “I will raise up for them a prophet like you,” He’s speaking to Moses. So there’ll be a prophet like Moses from among their brethren, which will be Jewish, “and I’m going to My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them all that I command Him. And it shall be that whoever will not hear My words, which He speaks in My name I will require it of him.” So this will be a greater prophet than Moses, that will be a Jew that will be God’s spokesman, but Moses was God’s spokesman. It will be almost like God’s word will be inside of Him. That’s what John was explaining. He said “The Word was with God, the Word was God, and the Word became flesh.” Then I read in Jeremiah 31:31 “Behold the day has come when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, not according to the covenant that I made with their forefathers which they violated, but under this covenant I will remember their sins no more. They shall know me and have intimacy with Me.”

Then I read the 53^rd chapter of Isaiah, I mean that was written 800 years before Jesus even came to earth. I read that same chapter to my Orthodox Jewish father who the last thing in the world would want to believe that Jesus was the Messiah. He said “You’re reading from a Christian Bible because you’re describing Jesus.” Then I read about His birth and His family and the Gentiles would follow Him, all in the Jewish scriptures. It is so clear you need help to get confused.

There are scales on the eyes of the Jewish people. I can just tell you my story and this was over 30 years ago. God restored my mind, He restored my health, He restored my marriage, He gave me what I was always looking for, He gave me intimacy with God. I know that there is a deeper intimacy, I know that there is a great Jewish wedding coming. I know that God is preparing His bride right now for that wedding, and I know that one of the catalysts for that wedding is intimacy with God. Another catalyst of that wedding is walking in signs and wonders, and the major catalyst for that wedding is for Gentile Christians to do what is written and not say “I want a flaky prophecy from a flaky prophet.” You’re not following the written words of the living God who says in Romans 11:11 “Salvation has come to the Gentile to provoke the Jew to jealousy.”

Your purpose is to reach Jewish people with the gospel, and somehow in reaching that Jewish person with the gospel it says “If it was a blessing the Jewish people rejected their Messiah, how much greater blessing when they receive their Messiah?” It’s going to cause life from the dead and the church will not become the institutional religious church that it has become today filled with as much tradition as we Jewish people have. It is going to be what the book of Ephesians calls “The glorious church” because it’s going to be so filled with the glory of God. When Jew and Gentile come together and that middle wall of separation comes down the Jew needs the Gentile Christian, the Gentile Christian needs the Jew. We are incomplete without each other, and in Him we become a new creation, that new creation has a name and His name is Jesus.  So simple you need help to get confused.

SID: Now Patricia tells me she has learned how to create atmospheres for God to show up. Give me some examples of this.

PATRICIA: Absolutely. You know Sid, God has made us to be co-creators with Him, because He created us in His image and likeness, you know. And He’s a creator, and He’s a ruler, and so we have that anointing resident within us, especially in Jesus, who is our life, who is our creation. So as we come to learn the keys that are in the scripture, we can actually create realms and atmospheres. So for example, one time I went into a church meeting. I walked into the meeting and you could feel the atmosphere was antagonistic, actually, skeptical. There was unbelief in the room. You could just feel the atmosphere. People were sitting there with their arms crossed and I thought, oh, this is going to be an interesting night to serve the Lord. And so I asked Jesus, I said, “Okay, what do I do to break this atmosphere? What do I do to create a different atmosphere?” And he put on my heart an idea to start prophesying, giving personal prophetic words, because the Bible is full of keys on how we can create with God.

SID: Yeah, but wait a second. If they’re skeptics, they’re not going to want a woman prophesying over them. They don’t even believe in prophecy.

PATRICIA: They might not have wanted it, but that’s what they got.

SID: Okay.

PATRICIA: Okay.

SID: What happened?

PATRICIA: So anyway, I started calling out some words of knowledge and started prophesying over individuals. And you could hear the, ooo, ah, you know, because God of course is going to give an accurate word. And so all of a sudden, the oppression left, the arms started being unfolded, and people started leaning forward. It was almost like they had invisible “pick-me” signs on their foreheads, because they wanted the next word. And the atmosphere changed, and as soon as it did, then I could preach the Word, and then God could do miracles. But we had to take care of the atmosphere first. We have the power to create atmospheres and also to create realms.

SID: How about in the workplace? Give me an example.

PATRICIA: Okay. Well one gentleman came to me one time and he was struggling. He wanted to quit his job. He was actually making some fairly good money at his workplace. He worked as a mechanic. But he said, “I’m vexed in my spirit. I am vexed.” He says, “I’m a Christian that loves good values, but in my workplace, there’s crude talk, there’s dirty jokes, and there’s pornography pinups on the walls.” And he said, “I just have to quit. I have to get out of it.” And I said, “Well if you feel a leading to get out of it, then absolutely go. But what about the invitation by God to bring light into that darkness? Do you think that if you partnered with God that you could use the authority of the Word, the authority of God’s presence and change that atmosphere? Instead of being afraid of it, instead of being vexed by it, think about changing it.” And he thought, “I never thought of that.” So I gave him a few keys, you know, a few keys to work with that are out of the scriptures, and I said, “Why don’t you see these keys, give them a try and see what happens.” Well it was a couple months later, I met him at a conference actually, and he said, “Do you remember me?” I said, “Yeah, I do.” I said, “How’s it going?” He said, “It works! It works!” And he didn’t quit his job. And he said, it came gradually, but he had so much joy over even the idea of being able to change the atmosphere, that he just went for it. And he said, over time it actually changed, and the bad talk and jokes stopped, and the coarse jokes stopped. The pinups came down. And it became an atmosphere of peace because he stepped forward to do that in partnership with Jesus.

SID: What exactly, give me an idea of what he might have done.

PATRICIA: Okay. Well one of the things that I suggested him to do is to make decrees. Now it says in Job that, if we decree a thing it will be established. Now a decree is an official word given by someone in authority. There’s no greater authority than Yeshua. All authority in Heaven and in Earth has been given to him, according to Matthew 28:18. And so we can take his word. It says in the scripture that his words are spirit and they are life. So when we decree that word, it says Esther 8:8, “When you make a decree in the name of a king it shall not be revoked.” So I said, “Why don’t you in your prayer time start decreeing holiness over your workplace. Start decreeing God’s righteousness, start decreeing purity.” And so he did that. That was one of the keys that he used. Another key is praise. Just praise God, not for the filth that’s in the workplace, but for what God is going to do in the workplace. Start praising Jesus for coming in as a king of kings and the Lord of Glory and creating an atmosphere of the Glory of God. And he used a number of different keys. And one of the greatest keys, Sid, is the key of love, of course. We’ll talk about that later.

SID: No, no, right now. I want to know, no, seriously, I really want to understand this. Because I know that I’m created and you’re created to walk in the compassion of Jesus. That’s when the miracles happen, to walk in the love of Jesus. What was a turning point in your life to be known as someone that walks in the love of God?

PATRICIA: Well one of the turning points that was key for me was I came under a time in ministry of big persecution. I had always wanted to love before then. It was an aim in my life. But when I came into this persecution time there was just huge assault on international levels, actually, on just every different level you can imagine.

SID: Someone didn’t want you sharing this tonight.

PATRICIA: And one night I was, I said, “Lord, I just love these people and I don’t want to be defensive, but what do I do?” And up out of my spirit arose these words: “I declare war.” And I thought, no, I don’t want war, I want peace. And then I declared it again. I thought, what’s going on here, and it was bubbling up out my spirit. And the third time was, “I declare war. It’s a love war.” And all of a sudden I got this download and I believe I received an impartation directly from the Lord, and He started showing me how He loved the most vilest of sinners. Everyone who came against Him he loved. He never withdrew love no matter what. I thought, Lord, I want to love like you love. If I can’t love with your love, it says in First Corinthians 13, “If we don’ t have love we are nothing and prophet is nothing, and we have nothing.” And I thought, Lord, I’m going to make it my life’s aim to learn to love.

SID: How about you? Do you want to declare a love war? I want to declare a love war. That’s our secret weapon. We’ll be right back. And find out when you declare a love war you can change an entire country.

Sid: I have a good friend that has been a friend of mine for many years Pastor Steve Gray from World Revival Church in Kansas City on the line. Steve and I go back to the days in Smithton, Missouri where in this tiny little town. I remember doing that video Steve and I would say “Here I am in the down town metropolis; there’s no cars going; there’s no dogs barking; there isn’t even gas in the gas station. But somehow and then these long lines of people coming to this tiny little town; what was the population Steve?

Steve: Yes 532 people it said on the sign.

Sid: (Laughing)

Steve:   Lined up to get into the church from all over the world; amazing.

Sid: But you know when you told me that God told you to move to Kansas City and start a new church I had to believe that you heard from God because that was such a prosperous thing to walk away from something so good.

Steve: Yeah.

Sid: So to speak and as history has it your’s is one of the few revivals that has been maintained and has been actually increasing. How many years has it been now?

Steve: Yeah, we’re at the 8 year; we’re just past the 8 year mark and it is wonderful. It is increasing; it is very intense, powerful, miracles and healings. Every service people getting up saying they’re healed. A lot of cancers disappearing and of course we have the House of Hope and Healing that’s opened 24 hours a day 7 days a week. So it gets a steady traffic of healings and miracles. And all of that put together it is burning red hot here. We had Claudio Freeze Zone was here last week and of course they’re known for revival down there that’s continuous and he was just amazed. He said that it just the comparison of all the churches that he’s been to in America he’s just can’ believe that it’s going on. Immediately he said, “I want you to come down to speak at my church in Argentina.” So it’s amazing how it’s continued to go on and has a lot to do with the hearts of the people and our desire to stay in that heat; that hot burning place with God and that burning bush.

Sid: So how come most haven’t stayed there; how come most haven’t stayed there? How come most that had a genuine move of God’s Spirit it literally walked out of their church?

Steve: It’s hard for me to understand it sometimes but the reports I’m getting are not real good; how much…how they swinging back to the traditional church or swinging back. And I’m thinking “What are they thinking; how can they handle that. But I think that as you and I’ve talked before I think that maybe the basic motives were wrong in the first place. We’re trying to use revival or use the movement of God or use the River or use refreshing to accomplish the goals that we think God wants to do which is to become as large as we can become. And of course you and I we both believe in evangelism so this is not anti-evangelism but you can skirt evangelism and just try to get a shifting of congregations. Get the people to come over to your church instead and that’s not really evangelism. And so…

Sid: No, that’s called sheep stealing.

Steve: Yeah, and…

Sid: And robbers don’t go to heaven; but any way that’s another story; go ahead. (Laughing)

Steve:   Well, you get the idea well if we have the latest move of God and the hottest moving thing they’ll all shift and my church will get bigger and I’ll get more money and I’ll get more famous and I’ll do all of these things. And and probably a story like mine when you get somebody who was in the middle of no where and all of a sudden they do get such prominence and newspapers and television it even feeds that more and says “Well, I’ll get this then and then I’ll become that.” But you can’t have the I’ve got to do that, but that wasn’t my motive. You know my motive; I just want to live and I wanted to live in the presence of God that’s it. And God came down so powerfully that it got attention, but it can’t be your motive. And something then when some churches didn’t grow like they thought or the money didn’t come in or they didn’t get on TV and in fact when God moves you know some people are going to leave because they don’t want a move of God.

Sid: Listen Steve; the hottest churches in America are what are called seeker sensitive.

Steve: Yeah.

Sid: I would have to believe that your church is the opposite of seeker sensitive.

Steve: Yes, mine I know it sounds odd but you know what mine’s a God sensitive church. And I want to be sensitive to God I want a church that God attends.

Sid: But does the ends justify the means? In other words if I was a pastor and I know that people only want a one hour service including message; including offering and come in a laid back causal manner and be entertained. And I could get the largest church in town; that’s very tempting; not to me but that must be very tempting to others because they’re doing it all over the United States. But the bottom line is they do preach the gospel and people do give their heart to the Lord. They don’t act much different than the world; but the truth is there are a number of converts.

Steve: Well yeah, but also the truth is they’re building it on sand because it works as long as there’s no storms or wind or anything blowing the house down.

Sid: Do you think there’s going to be some storms or winds in the United States of America?

Steve: Well, I think there’s certainly some signs that it could happen. And you know we’re teetering on the edge of terrorism anytime. You hear it every day this could happen happen; that could happen; and you know you don’t…you hope not but on the other hand even the personal storms that people have. I noticed this that people that go to those churches that cater to everything they want but when things don’t go the way they want then where do they go; they can’t go back to what they want again. So it’s a little bit on building on sand and I think the people will find that to be true. The other thing I think is that we’re finding in the population of America signs of a great awakening. And I think that the last thing that the people in America who are getting hungry for God; the real thing they want reality Christianity. And they don’t want to be catered to they said they spent their whole life catering to their needs; their wants; their desires and the result has been divorce, and dysfunction and depression. And so you just come and wrap it in a few hymns and sermon; it’s still catering to us and it still produces the fruit – same fruit. So it’s a little deceptive in that it looks shiny; it’s almost like a white-washed tomb.

Sid: But you know there’s another thing that I want to mention and that is there is an attack on the supernatural of God. When I first became a believer coming from a Jewish background a little over 30 years ago Charismatic Church everyone spoke in tongues and moved in gifts of the Spirit; a Pentecostal Church of course. Today I believe the average Charismatic or Pentecostal Church a low percentage even speak in tongues.

Steve: Yeah, and as you know and I’ve been in the services where they actually instruct the congregation not to speak in tongues. Or the…how about this for hypocrisy you can speak in tongues on the Sunday Night Service or the River Service or the revival but not on Sunday morning. Don’t speak in tongues and don’t raise your hands on Sunday Morning but you can do it Sunday night or if they had a Sunday night or if they have sometimes they’ll schedule a Contemporary Service and they’ll have the traditional service and they’ll tell them which service that they could do it and which service that they can’t (Giggling). I mean it just I don’t know if it gets any more hypocritical than that.

Sid: And there’s another thing that I want to mention; there are more good Christian…and I don’t remember this ever in my 30 years of walking with the Lord there are so many good Christians that don’t even go to church any more. And they still love the Lord; they still read the Bible and they still pray, but they don’t go to church because they don’t see it touching their spirit.

Steve: Yeah, that is a bad problem and then they know the church they’re going to is not touching their spirit just like you said and then the problem is they’ve spent so many years in a church that didn’t touch their spirit that I think they got planted in them is suspicion to be suspicious of any place that does touch their spirit.

Sid: Ym.

Steve: So they’re really locked into a situation where they’re going to have to make some…well, they really just need to open their Bible and read what God does and who He is and find that. But so I find that they don’t go to church because there so discouraged that the church that they went to; but they’re afraid to go to church that God’s really doing stuff because that level of doubt has been planted in them too.

Sid: Let me give you a spin; I believe that God is about ready to pour out His Spirit on young people; why young people? Because the older people aren’t willing to change. And when He pours out His Spirit on young people I believe large number of unsaved Jewish people are about ready to get saved. And you get a Jew and a Gentile that become that One New Man that Paul talks about there’s going to be a spark that is going to literally light an atomic bomb and we’re going to see the glory of God once again in the glorious church.

Steve: I pumped that One New Man into our congregation; and you know our congregation is I mean we have 40% of our congregation are singles and young. And I mean it’s powerful and new ones are coming off the street all the time. We have a lot of outreach here and stuff and boy get them filled and it’s amazing what you can do with a person if they get saved; get filled with the Spirit and every week they got to sit down next to firebrand rather than a lukewarm; half-hearted person looking at their watch.

Sid: Let’s face it you become like the people you associate with.

Steve: Absolutely, hypocrisy is a yeast and so it gets on you if you sit by it too long; and so people have sat by it for so long and have been told that it’s okay that they don’t realize that it’s getting on them; I think that that’s maybe where that deception comes. But what would happen if all of your listeners that are discouraged or haven’t found a church home take back 5, 10, 15 or 20 years ago when they got saved; what if every service they sat next to somebody on fire who could careless about the world; didn’t care how long the service went; loved God with all of their hearts, soul; mind and strength; wanted the presence of God annd every church that they went to that’s what they found. Who would that person be today? And most people would agree that they’d be a totally different person. It’s being around all of this other junk that’s worn us down. So like you know I think that’s why the young people are the hope and some of us older middle-aged people we can get on the bandwagon there’s nothing stopping us.

Sid: Listen, Joshua and Caleb made it and I’m going to make it.

Steve: That’s right.

Sid: (Laughing)

Steve: There are acceptions Kathy’s parents, my wife’s parents Kathy they’re in their 70’s but I forget; 78 or no; he’s going to be 80 years old and this guy has got revival in his soul.   And he’s as fiery as ever; so it can happen but it’s rare so we have to go to our new resources.   And you know I told I told one Jewish Rabbi was so disappointed; he’s a believer in Yeshua and he looked right at me and he knew what I wanted, knew that I was believing and he said “Steve I got to tell you we don’t want that one new man.” Some Jews, not every Jew…

Sid: Let’s stop right here because we’re out of time and hey you better come back tomorrow!

Sid: For the past 30 years I have been diligently trying to understand everything I could possibly understand in reference to healing and faith to miracles because the Bible is very clear, if you want to reach a Jewish person with the gospel it says “The Jew requires a sign.” Now when I was a brand new believer just starting out there was a couple by the name of Francis and Charles Hunter. They would have meetings in the… at that time I lived in the Washington DC area and they would have meetings. And outside of the Hunters and Kathryn Kuhlman I didn’t know anyone that would pray for people. And the power of God would cause them to fall over. But the difference between the Hunters and the Kuhlman ministry is the Hunters would share this gift. Meaning that they would have… I have on the telephone Francis Hunter from her office in Houston and Francis you may not remember this but my wife and myself…you’d say “Anyone that want to move in this gift come on up on the platform with us” and so my wife and I would come up on the platform and we would… well I don’t think Joyce did at that time come to think of it. I went up on the platform and you’d said “Okay pray for people.” And I pray for people and they would be slain in the Spirit. You don’t like to hoard the gifts yourself do you?

Francis: No.

Sid: And as a matter of fact that’s what God’s created an evangelist for.

Francis: Amen.

Sid: To equip not to just be a superstar. You know I have just been reading your book “How to Heal the Sick.” And although it’s not a brand new book it reads like a brand new book; did you know that?

Francis: That’s what everybody says it just reads like a brand new book. As a matter of fact I was sitting at my desk this morning and I got 3 or 4 letters from people who said “I just found your book “How to Heal the Sick” and it has changed my life forever because I never knew that I could heal the sick.

Sid: Listen, the Producer of my radio show her job is reading books; she reads them all the time. And she said “Sid, you’re not going to believe this but I have just read this book by Francis Hunger called “Heal the Sick” it was written a number of years ago but it has done such wonders for my faith. Now for her to say this it means something because she’s reading the latest books all the time!”

Francis: Hallelujah!

Sid: But any way there’s something in this book that got me so excited. Actually I had read the book previously but there is several prophecies at the beginning of the book and one by a man by the name of Tommy Hicks. And I’m not going to take the valuable time to read all of it they can get the book because it’s a very long prophecy but this is something that God used to confirm the ministry He called you and Charles to. And I want to read a portion of it because whereas when you read this Francis I believe you thought that this was going to happen immediately. It is my contention but as I’m reading this this is what I see in the Spirit; I know that I know, that I know, that I know that what I’m about ready to read to you is about ready to happen on planet earth. I’ll just read a little bit of it; are you as excited as I am?

Francis: I would rather be alive today than any other time in the history of the world.

Sid: How young are you?”

Francis: Eighty-eight. (Laughing) I just had my 88^th Birthday last Friday.

Sid: Oh, well I wish I had known we would have had the interview Friday and I could have sung Happy Birthday. This is better than Happy Birthday.   I’m going to read from page 11 of Francis Hunter’s book “How.” And that’s the key operative word, “How To Heal the Sick.”

Francis: Good.

Sid: And this prophecy came in 1961 through Tommy Hicks.

Francis: Yeah.

Sid: And I’m just reading a portion of it. “At that moment there came a thunder that seemed to roar from the heavens.” And I’ve got to interrupt myself right now I have to tell you that this Tommy Hicks turned a whole nation upside down with the power of God. So he he’s a man you want to listen to when God says something.

Francis: Yes.

Sid: Alright, here it comes.

Tommy Hicks ’61 prophecy: At that very moment there came a great thunder that seemed to roar from the heavens. I turned my eyes toward the heavens and suddenly I saw a figure in white en-glistening white. The most glorious thing that I’ve ever seen in my entire life! I did not see the face but somehow I knew that it was the Lord Jesus Christ and He stretched forth His hand and as He did He would stretch it for one and to another and then to another. And as He stretched forth his hand upon the nations and upon the people of the world men and women as He pointed towards them this liquid light seemed to flow from His hands into them. And a mighty anointing of God came upon them and those people began to go forth in the Name of the Lord. I do not now know how long I watched it. (See this was a vision that he was having) He says I do not know how long I watched it it seemed it went into days and weeks and months I beheld this Christ as He continued to stretch forth His hand. But there was a tragedy; there were many people that as He stretched forth His hand that refused the anointing of God and the call of God. I saw men and woman that I knew; people that I felt would certainly receive the call of God. But as He stretch forth His hand towards this one and that one they simply bowed their head and began to back away. And each of those that seemed to bow down and back away seemed to go into darkness, blackness seemed to swallow them everywhere. I was bewildered as I watched it but these people that He had anointed 100’s of 1000’s of people all over the world in Africa, England, Russia, China, America all over the world the anointing of God was upon these people. As they went forward in the Name of the Lord I saw these men and women as they went forth. They were ditch diggers, they were washer woman, they were rich men; they were poor men. I saw people that were bound with paralysis and sickness; blindness and deafness as the Lord stretched forth to give them this anointing they became well; they became healed they went forth. And this is the miracle of it; this is the glorious miracle of it these people would stretch forth their hands exactly as the Lord did and it seemed that as if there was the same liquid fire in their hands as they stretched forth their hands they said “According to my word be thou made whole.”

Francis: Hallelujah!

Tommy Hicks ’61 Prophecy Continues: As these people continued in this mighty end-time ministry I did not fully realize what it was and I looked to the Lord and said “What is the meaning of this?” And He said “This is that which I will do in the last days.”

Sid: Well, I’m going to stop right now you’ll have to read that whole prophecy yourself in the book. But I’ll tell you Francis and those Mishpochah (that’s a Hebrew word that means family) those Mishpochah that are listening to us right now this is ready to happen. Now who do you think is going to say yes Lord when He comes to put this miraculous faith healing anointing upon you to do great and mighty works; to do the same works He did and as He said “Even greater.” Because so many will be walking in this power; are you going to say “Yes” or are you going to say “No.” Well I believe that those that are hungering for more; those that are not satisfied with the mediocrity of traditional religion; those that say “There is more and I’m going for the gold.” Now I have Francis Hunter on the telephone and she is 88 years young and I tell you that she is going for the gold. Francis “What do you believe will happen from someone that reads your book “How To Heal the Sick?”

Francis: I believe that they will learn how to heal the sick because God is going to give the world a demonstration in this last hour as the world has ever known. Now I’m reading the rest of this probably a little bit it says:

Tommy Hicks Prophecy continued It says these men and woman are from all walks of like, degree will mean nothing when one would stumble and fall another will pick it up. There was no “Big I” and “Little you,” but every mountain was brought low and every valley was exalted. And they seemed to have one thing in common; there was a Divine love; a Divine love that seemed to flow forth from these people as they worked together and as they lived together.

Sid: And you know the thing that we got to tell more about this prophecy.

Tommy Hicks Prophecy cont’d: He said “I didn’t see denominations; what I saw was the Body of Messiah; people loving one another; not having differences, people preferring one another.”

Sid: I have to believe Francis that what we saw was a snapshot of the first church; not the 21 century American Church.

Francis: Amen.

Sid: There has got to be a change and it’s coming and I have to tell you Mishpochah when you read this book it’s going to put a fire in you. A fire to believe that it’s not the superstar that is going to cause the people in your neighborhood to be healed and then believe in the Messiah. It’s going to be the Superstar in you.

Francis: Yeah.

Sid: And you used a key word Francis; you said that “God wants a demonstration of His power.” The key word is demonstration of His power before He returns. And that prophecy goes on to say some pretty bad things that will happen for those that don’t know the Messiah.

Francis: Yes.

Sid: But Francis I’m looking at some of the miracles that you’ve witnessed with your own eyes. For instance even I the book you talk about someone’s thumb literally grew out 75 people saw this.

Francis: Grew back on in front of everybody.

Sid: What do you mean “Grew back on;” explain that.

Francis: Well, there was no thumb; I mean the thumb had been cut off and we prayed for the thumb and as we stood there and looked at it the thumb grew right back on the finger. Right back on, he came up with a thumb that where the entire last knuckle where the fingernail would be that was totally cut off; there is just a little stub there. And then the finger totally grew out perfectly. And then after the finger grew out then the fingernail grew on it. That almost blew us away. (Laughing)

Sid: I’ll tell you your experiences and stories with angels and with healing. But the one thing about your books is you’re not the star.

Francis: No, you see we believe Charles and Frances can do it you can do it too.” And that means to everybody in your listening audience. If we can do it they can do it too.

Sid: Accept one thing you can’t do is give me more time right now. We’re out of time Mishpochah we’ll pick up right here on tomorrow’s broadcast.

Sid: James, I am so fascinated by so many thing of the supernatural variety that have happened in your life. For instance tell me about that thing that happened in Jakarta, Indonesia, the Muslim bodyguard.

James:   Yes it’s amazing story I was just a privileged to be a part of it this happened just in June of this last June 2013. I’m I Jakarta, Indonesia and there’s like a big conference like about 5000 people or more that are there and that’s the largest Muslim populated nation of the world. And I have a police escort and I have a professionally trained bodyguard and I have all of this because of the intensity of all of the people and everything. And so anyway so I’m speaking at this conference and my professionally trained bodyguard is actually a Muslim, He had never one time ever been in a church or a Christian worship or conference setting in his entire life. So he is my bodyguard, he’s with me everywhere I go. So I’m up there speaking and I’m really saying prophetic declarations and the Holy Spirit is manifesting on 1000’s of people. While this is happening this guy gets catapulted into an open vision and he sees 5 white means and they were 5 angels that came and appeared to him. And then the next morning Bill Johnson and I are taking turns teaching and one of us taught and enters the in between. The guy goes up so it’s his second service that he’s ever going to be in in his life time. He doesn’t even know protocol he takes the microphone and he tells people then it’s translated from Indonesian over to me in English. And he says, I’m a Muslim and while Prophet James Goll was ministering and I’m serving Prophet James Goll and while he was ministering 5 angels came and appeared to him. The thing that fascinating is that well Muslim’s do not obviously see that Jesus is the Messiah and they do believe in prophets. And Jesus taught that if you receive a prophet in the name of a prophet you’ll receive a prophets reward. So he was serving me and he even referred to me as a prophet. So the next day, guess what I was going to speak on Sid?

Sid:     What?

James: It was really amazing you’re going to love this. So I’m like arguing with Holy Spirit; I mean I’m talking with the Holy Spirit. And the Holy Spirit said to me “I want you to speak on why I pray and take a stand for Israel.

Sid: You know I was going to say that I should have said it but go ahead. (Laughing)

James: I’m going like “Well Lord don’t you know where I’m at; this is a Muslim…

Sid:   (Laughing)

James: Wrong guy, wrong place, wrong message I said “Why I pray and take a stand for Israel.” Wrong guy, wrong place, wrong message….

Sid: By the way I did that once in the West Bank in a Muslim area and they stood up and they started yelling at me Mossad agent; so I understand but go ahead. (Laughing)

James:   So anyway I go, so I go “Okay, I yield the right of way.” So while I’m doing this intense wonderful message on “Why I pray and take a stand for Israel,” my Muslim bodyguard in the middle of this message on Israel, and I wondered if this is not tied together, he has another visitation. Jesus and His 12 disciples hadn’t even heard of this one before; Jesus with His 12 disciples appears to him and Jesus looks at him and says “Would you be one of my disciples?”

Sid: Hm.

James: So this Muslim man in the middle of this Christian huge big worship and supernatural conference I’m speaking on “Why I pray and take a stand for Israel” has a visitation where Jesus appears to him and he gives his life to Jesus. My armor bearer ends up disciplining my bodyguard; I have gotten reports since then that the guys gotten water baptized; that his whole family has come to faith and he’s a member of a church. So isn’t that awesome.

Sid: James, why is it I am hearing for the first time in my life more Muslim’s are having visitations by Jesus and now it’s starting to happen to Jewish people visitations of Jesus. Why is this going on right now prophetically?

James: Because, wow we need it to happen just one. But it is a sign of the time; obviously you know the Book of Acts and the Book of Joel says “In the last days I will pour out My Spirit upon all flesh and old men will dream dreams and young men will have visions.” So I’ve been declaring for I’d say 15 years that the Islamic veil will be pierced. I’ve said it all over the world and I’ve said that “The Islamic veil will be pierced.” I didn’t say the Islam will disappear all I’ve said is that the “Islamic veil will be pierced.” And I have prophesied and I’m going to keep on prophesying until I see it with my own eyes that whole mosque and minarets are going to be turned over to 24-7, 365 relevant places of worship and prayer unto the One true God and His Name is Yeshua, His Name is Jesus.

Sid:     Wait a second in addition to the mosques can we include synagogues in that?

James:   Come on let’s do it.

Sid:     Will you proclaim that right now James?

James: Yes we will, I just speak it’s time for visitations; it’s time for the fire of God; it’s time for the wind of the Lord to come like the day of Pentecost. And even as it came to the Upper Room so it shall return back to the place of its origin. And we just speak forth the back to Jerusalem movement. And just say that the Islamic veil will be pierced but not only the Islamic veil will be pierced but the blinders shall come off the Jewish people eyes and they shall behold that Yeshua is their, our Messiah. And so we speak forth right now to Jew and Gentile across the world the greatest global awakening the world has ever seen for God’s holy Name sake.

Sid:   I’m going to tell you something; it’s happening now but it’s going to happen with greater intensity. In 1993 you had 9 straight weeks of angelic visitations; tell me about how it started.

James:   (Laughing) Well it’s pretty amazing I was teaching at the Grace Training Center at Kansas City and it was the Day of Atonement. I always present myself you know to the Lord on that special day the Day of Atonement, Yom Kippur the 10 days of Awe. And so I get home late after teaching a class I said I’m going to speak tonight. I left my assistant off and I get home and I crawl into bed and it’s after 11:00 and at 11:59 at night a lightning bolt struck in the back yard and I wake up. And the lightning from the lightning bolt came crashing through our bedroom window and a man stood at the end of my bed at 11:59 and it was an angel and it looked straight at me and then the clock turns to midnight and he says “Watch your wife I’m about to speak to her” and this the Day of Atonement opened up 9 straight weeks of angelic visitations. It was a supernatural ball of fire of light that set over our bedroom dresser from midnight until 5:00AM in the morning that night. And it opened the door to amazing God encounters, angels, the fire of God, Jesus actually coming and sang a song over us one night. And it was just amazing period and that was an amazing period of time because there was like you cross thresholds at different times and seasons. And that was a threshold that was being crossed; you know The Father’s blessing in Toronto that starts to be poured out; and then just 9 straight weeks after this. And so God is good and not a respecter of person and what He did for me He wants to do for you and He wants to invade your uncomfortable zones and He wants to come touch you, love you, heal you and overpower you with the revelation of His Majesty.

Sid: Now are there any born again Spirit filled Christians that do not have some of these supernatural gifts?

James: You know actually everyone does, but they need to be activated. And we need to get into the right culture for them to be enhanced, or empowered. So everybody has this but some people are dull but we can all be awakened. And that’s why I wrote that book because I want every single believer to be awakened into our full inheritance in Christ Jesus.

Sid: I have to tell you when I became a believer over 40 years ago now I came in in the charismatic movement and everything was experience. I just wished that I had been grounded in the supernatural gifts and the supernatural fruit of the Spirit….

Sid: My guest is Katherine Ruonala. Katherine and her husband pastor a church in Brisbane, Australia. And Katherine I don’t believe it’s an accident Katherine that that’s your first name because as I read about you I think about another Katherine that I personally got to know, Katherine Kuhlman. Some mutual friends of ours have been saying that you’re really walking in that anointing. In fact you told me that you walk by people and they get healed, tell me one.

Katherine: Well that’s just last month I got a report when I was back in an area I had been in last year and a lady was so excited to tell me that she’s been in a meeting that as I walked past she felt a wind of the Spirit go through her and she was instantly healed. And you know I believe that we are meant to be carries of the Holy Spirit but Katherine Kuhlman is someone who’s been so important to me. To see the relationship she had with the Holy Spirit; I remember one night I was coming home from a meeting where God had done an amazing miracle, in fact many amazing miracles. And I felt a little bit intimidated thinking that I had another meeting tomorrow night and all of these people are going to bring all of their sick friends because they’d watched with their own eyes extraordinary things.

Sid: Tell me one miracle at that time that had occurred.

Katherine: Well that night one lady had had her eardrum cut out because of cancer had her hearing restored and cataracts had clouded a man’s eyes had instantly dissolved. And people were just so excited and I remember climbing the stairs to my room that night I was staying at the pastor’s home and thinking to myself “Oh, Lord I know I didn’t do that I hope you show up tomorrow night and do it again.” And as I was coming up the stairs I left my computer playing on shuffle and I heard one of Katherine Kuhlman’s heart to heart radio talks. And she was saying as I was thinking these things I heard her say “Every time I walk out on to the platform I die a thousand deaths.”

Sid: And I remember hearing her say that by the way, but go ahead.

Katherine: Knowing that people are coming and this is their last hope. And I thought to myself “Oh, I understand that pressure.” But it was so lovely to hear her continue she said “But I encourage myself that everything Jesus did on the earth He did as a man actually dependent on the Holy Spirit.” And then as I walked I to my room she said “The Holy Spirit never let her down.” And I heard her say “And the Holy Spirit will never let you down.” And I felt like I’d been kissed by God.

Sid: Hmm.

Katherine: The next night more deaf ears opened, more miracles happened; it was just such an encouragement from the Holy Spirit that we can actually depend on Him because He is utterly dependable. You can only fully know that as you get to know Him personally.

Sid: Now I talked to you a few days ago and you talked to me about a subject that I want you to discuss and that is humility and totally helpless without God.

Katherine: Oh yes you know I really believe this is the word of the Lord at the moment that God is really wanting to open up our eyes to see the depth of our need. Because I believe that it’s really when we understand our need for God that we will cry out and we’ll receive what He wants to give. I believe it’s to the level of your need that you’ll go to God to get what He wants to give. You know in the Book of Revelation it talks about a church that thinks of themselves as rich and having need of nothing. And we’re counseled to cry out to God to buy eyesalve and I think praying that even myself recently “Lord give me eyesalve to see the depth of my need.” I remember once being on an altar call and in the early days and just crying out to God saying “Lord, I feel like I have a big jagged cut in my life and nobody is able to fill my need for love.” And I was looking at the cut I saw a piece of heaven coming out shaped right down in exactly the same shape as the cut in my life. You know I believe God wants to fill us with the level of our deepest need; but unless we’re aware of our need for Him we are not going to go to Him and get what He wants to give us. He says He’s laid a banqueting table before us in the presence of our enemies but unless we actually recognize our need; unless we go to Him to let Him show us we are desperately needy, that we’re actually not rich and full and having need to nothing. We are desperately full of need then we miss out on the truth filling; we spend our money on what’s not actually bread like the scriptures says and yet God’s wanting us to exchange our weakness. Use that as currency, exchange our weakness so that we can receive His supernatural strength.

Sid: Well you know Katherine a lot of people look at the ministry that God’s entrusted to me and they think “Boy, he’s a sharp businessman; he’s brilliant; he’s got so much gifting. But guess what I know what you’ve been talking about; I am 100% dependent on God not just for a miracle to happen, that’s minor; for everything to happen. And the older I get the smarter I get, and when I say the smarter I get the reason I get so much is I realize I need God more. When I was younger I didn’t realize it I was stupid; now that I’m older I realize how much I need God in every relationship and everything that goes on in my life. And that’s what I see going on with you right now Katherine.

Katherine: He’s our ever present help in my time of need and my time of need is all the time. And I really believe that is one of the best revelations that God’s given me because knowing that I need His help and knowing that He’s so willing and so wanting to give me more than I need has been the key I believe really to walking in a joy and a deep satisfaction that produces fruit and supernatural miracles.

Sid: You know I read a book a number of years ago about the presence of God that was Brother Lawrence “Practicing the presence of God.” And to what degree do you do that?

Katherine: I need to spend time alone with God more than I need anything. So I love to walk and talk with God. I do all my verbal processing with Him; I tell Him how I’m feeling and I look to Him for help. You know He is my ever present help and He’s my teacher and my counselor and when I expose my need to Him; when I talk to Him about my fears; when I talk to Him about my weaknesses, He’s always got the answer for me. And He always manifests Himself to me with what I need. The Bible tells us that He makes us lie down in green pastures and He restores our soul. And every day I believe that God wants to bring us daily bread, He wants to help us. And unless we actually take advantage of this beautiful fellowship we miss out on the rich fair that God wants to feed us with day by day. To walk with Him is my greatest joy and it’s the thing I need about above anything else.

Sid: Now when you pray for someone and they’ve got… let’s take the person that had no ear and no eardrum. You certainly… you don’t have to be a PhD to know that you’re in trouble if God doesn’t show up. So you put your hand on them and you pray but what’s going on inside of Katherine Ruonala?

Katherine: Oh, at that moment I was thinking that it might grow back overnight. I honestly did not feel like I had huge faith but this I know that when God tells me to do something that obedience brings blessing. I just trust the He knows what He’s doing; and you know that sometimes when I go to pray for the sick I find myself you know really wanting to see it happen. And Holy Spirit will just tap me on the shoulder and say “Rest back into Me.” Because it’s through Him that it flows and as a result I’ve started to see people get healed before I get to lay hands on them. I started to become God’s reporter that when I have word of knowledge they step out and God touch them before I can even get to them.

Sid: And you know what it sounds like it’s almost like… I kid around a lot sometimes I demonstrate it when I’m speaking before a group. I say “Watch this and I’m not going to say a word and watch what happens to the presence of God.” And the minute I shut my mouth the presence of God increases; so it lets me know how important I am to the deal.   (Laughing)

Katherine: Oh, it’s so true and He just enjoys working with us; He enjoys working through us. But I tell you He is God and He is the healer and when people become aware of His presence and reach out to Him He is irresistibly drawn to anybody that will become vulnerable and expose their need to Him and look to Him for help. Jesus always manifests Himself as the answer; that’s who He is. And that’s who He was when we read about Him in the scripture; everyone who came to Him with a problem and looked to Him for help He manifested Himself as the answer to them. And He’s the same yesterday, today and forever if we’ll get humble and expose our need to Him and look to Him.

Sid: You know I don’t hear that word that often humble, humility and that is the missing ingredient in many many Christians. But I’ll tell you what Katherine wants to mentor you because that’s what she does she’s got a whole ministry team that does what she does….

Sid: My guest by way of telephone is Dr. James Richards I’m interviewing him on his book “How to Stop the Pain.” Pain maybe in evitable but suffering optional, but what’s even more exciting to me is there are walls between husbands and wives, children and parents, wives and husbands, pastors and members of the congregations, employers and employees, schoolmates everything these walls… and God is supernaturally showing us how these walls can come down and we don’t have to keep that pain Yeshua took the pain for us. But one of the most fascinating things Jim in your book has to do with the correlation between sickness and judgment. On yesterday’s broadcast you were saying that physiologically when we make judgments we open ourselves it’s almost like a door is open for sickness explain this.

Jim: Exactly that’s right and incredibly the mind always seeks equilibrium. In other words, the moment you pass a judgment everything in your mind and in your brain actually goes to work to prove that it’s true. There’s a little bundle of nerves…

Sid: Give me an example of a judgment and then explain what you’re explaining.

Jim: Okay the judgment is assuming to know why someone is doing something. Of course the brain actually does this on any assumption it doesn’t have to be a judgment. I’ll give you a good example let’s say you look down the street here and you a lady and she kind of dressed maybe what you might consider a little like a temptress or something.

Sid: And you see, hay not down the street you see them in church.

Jim: Yeah.

Sid: And you form that judgment, that everyone can relate there.

Jim: You say “This is why she is this way she’s loose she’s immoral.” And you watch her as she walks down the street and you notice that she’s walking up to men and talking to them. So you’re absolutely sure then that she’s a prostitute and that she’s trying to sell herself to these men. And everything that you begin to see there’s a little bundle of nerves called the reticular activating system at the base of the skull…

Sid: And you know the devil doesn’t even have to function in this you’re doing just fine you’re doing his job. (Laughing)

Jim: You’re doing his job and he’s taking a little break and laughing at you. Well the moment that you pass a judgment or make an assumption the reticular activating system starts changing the function of the brain and you go into selective processing and you begin to only see and notice those things that support your judgment or your opinion. So now you’re seeing all of this stuff that tells you this woman’s a prostitute. Now when she gets up to you she walks up to you you’re ready for her to proposition you she hands you a track and you find out that she’s a Christian and she was witnessing to those people and you didn’t even notice that she was carrying a Bible, and you didn’t even notice any of these other factors all you noticed would be those things that would support your judgment.

Sid: Selective editing.

Jim: And we do that I don’t know if you’ve ever done it you go to the grocery store and you’re wife says go pick up this stuff and make sure you get this brand and make sure that it doesn’t have any salt in it. You run in the grocery store you look at the label you pick it up you run back home; you open the bag and you proudly hand it to your wife and she’s like “What did you get this for?” And you look at it and its like “That’s not what I bought.” But you and I both know that you can look at something and believe that you’re reading a different label.

Sid: So we humans because of Adams original sin, our disposition is to judge and when we judge what happens now physiologically?

Jim: When we judge… here’s the incredible thing here’s the place that judgment and sickness comes together is basically the judgments we pass about ourselves and even the judgments that we pass about God. If I’m… see guilt brings the expectation of punishment. And so when I commit when I commit a particular sin when I struggle with something and I pass a judgment on God you know and maybe things begin to go wrong in my life I say “This is why this is happening God is doing this to me.” You know we run a substance abuse clinic for years and we found that you can’t get people off drugs and you can’t get people well if they believe God’s doing it to them or they believe that it’s punishment for something they’ve done.

Sid: Hm.

Jim: Now what happens every cell in the body actually has intelligence. With the advent of our understanding of DNA this has become common knowledge in the scientific community. And you figure that there’s enough intelligence in a cell to clone a human being possibly, we know that they can clone an animal so there’s a lot of intelligence there. Well that intelligence in every cell is not just intellectual intelligence it’s also emotional intelligence. So anything that you believe at a very deep level every cell in your body believes it and works to make it happen. So if I’m in expectation of punishment coming to me from something that I have done the fact that I’m expecting that, the fact that I have…

Sid: Isn’t that what Job was saying when he said “The thing that I feared…”

Jim: Sure.

Sid: “…has come upon me?”

Jim: Exactly, that’s what the children of Israel did. They said the tested or tempted God they put God on trial they passed the judgment that says “He could not be trusted.” And that’s why they fell in the wilderness. So the person that believes something every cell in their body works and if you believe for example that you’re unworthy of success then every time you have the opportunity to succeed you’re going to have a conflict with your boss and something’s going to go wrong. And you can scream at the devil you can pray more but the truth is until you release your judgments and renew your mind it’s going to keep going that way.

Sid: Someone that’s accident prone that might be the reason.

Jim: Exactly. Interesting thing, I don’t know if we have enough time to go into this, but I had a problem that where every time I had an off day I got sick. I either got sick, felt bad or injured myself. And so this went on for years and finally after several years in my lightning quick mind I said “There’s a problem, there’s something wrong here.”

Sid: (Laughing)

Jim: I spent some time in prayer and meditation just seeking God and the Lord brought to my memory a time when I was a child and my father had come home and beat my mother all night. And the next morning she was getting ready to go to work I was extremely emotional I was crying and I was pleading with her “Please do not go to work.” And she said “Son as long as I’m able I have to work.” Now I developed a belief from that that said “The only reason not to work is to not be able.” Out of that belief every time I’d get an off day I’d get sick or injure myself and when I realized that all of this was emerging out of my own heart it was as simple as releasing that belief choosing a new belief and moving on and bringing an end to it and it doesn’t happen anymore.

Sid: Do you think that all sicknesses is a result of what you just described?

Jim: No, I don’t think that all sicknesses are we have physiologically things that happen to us. I have found that the ability to recover from sickness is directly related to our beliefs and particularly our beliefs about worthiness.

Sid: Give me another specific example.

Jim: A specific example?

Sid: Yes.

Jim: I have had dozens of people in my clinic that this has happened to. A person comes in… I’ll give you one on weight loss this is

Sid: Oh, I want that one.

Jim: There’s somebody that comes in their… and this actually happened a lady she was probably 300 pounds overweight she had tried everything in the whole world nothing ever worked. I began to work with her and she had lost about 80 or 100 pounds. Suddenly she just loses her mind, metaphorically, goes crazy goes on an eating binge disappears won’t come back into the clinic. Now ultimately what I was eventually able to discover in working with her was that she had a belief that if she was thin that she would get into sin because she had a promiscuous past. And she had passed this judgment about herself and about why I do this and why you know why it would happen to me if I looked thin again. And so even though she was getting the desired results she sabotaged it. Actually studies show that most people’s fatal illness occur at their moments of great opportunity.

Sid: Explain that.

Jim: Really most people don’t believe that they deserve to retire they’ve worked all of their life they don’t feel qualified, they don’t feel it’s right that they have something. Like in my example I grew up believing that I was unlovable. So when I would get in a relationship the moment the relationship would begin to become good I would destroy it and run. See the same thing happened with sickness, it happens with finances if we live out our beliefs and judgments and literally can’t see life any other way.

Sid: Jim how did you come to all of this understanding? This is brilliant it really is.

Jim: Well again you know fortunately for me I wasn’t raised in church so I didn’t have a lot of preconceived ideas. And when I read the Bible I didn’t read it so much from a mystical point of view I read it from a very practical point of view. And really all of this came out of number 1 the pages of the Bible, and then me applying this to my personal life. Then taking it into the lives of the people that I have ministered to for these 30 years.

Sid: Quick give me a testimony of somebody that’s read your book and what’s happened to them.

Jim: This doesn’t have anything to do with healing but one particular testimony pops in mind was a man who calls me and he said “You know something my wife and I have been reading your material.” And he said “We’ve been married we’ve come from a strict background not a lot of love and compassion shown in his background.” He said “You know for the first time in 21 years out of her own initiative she put her arms around me and told me she loved me.”

Sid: You know I’ve got to interrupt this right now because God is telling me right now that people’s spines are being healed right now.  And backs and pain and necks and any pain it’s gone in Yeshua’s Name.  Holy Spirit You interrupt me anytime You want to; I’ve got on the telephone from their home in Casa Grande, Arizona, Pat and Patty McEnnerney.  And Pat you and your wife move in such extraordinary power.  And one of the keys that opened this up was dying to self.  Well, listen there are many believers that say “I’d like to but I can’t; what do I do, what does this die to self mean?  I mean it’s all God He’s got to do it; do I have a part?”

Pat:  Hallelujah, everybody has a part.  Let me just share quickly consecration is the key.  And if you take 2^nd Corinthians 3:16, 17, 18 is a concentration prayer and it talks about the glory in you as looking in the mirror.  And the last of that says “And by the Holy Ghost.”  When Adam and Eve when they sinned man fell back in himself and split, separated, the raiment the glory of God.  And they lost their heavenly state and Jesus restored us as before sin.  Hallelujah and so we have a heavenly state and earthly state and the soul has to be restored.  Your spirit when you receive Jesus is instantly recreated and the demonic nature is removed from it.  And then you have to put on the mind of Christ; then you have to with trembling and fear walk out your salvation.  Many don’t understand that.

Sid: This trembling and fear doesn’t even compute in 21^st century American Christianity.

Pat:  We’ve lost it.  The fear of God must be embraced and cried out for.  You must beckon the Lord to draw you into Him. You know it’s His desire.

Sid: You know get practical; what should someone do?  A-B-C.

Pat:  ABC repent, Lord forgive me I’m blind in areas, I see that I want to be holy and pure and I see that I’m not.  Holy Spirit I give you permission to destroy and remove every vice; to remove all hardness of my eyes enlighten my understanding to the Rhema living Word Jesus.

Sid: Why do we have to give God permission; why doesn’t He just take it?

Pat:  Awe, that’s the beautiful thing of the gospel; the love that God offers must be received.  He’s knocking at the door; you must open it.  You know that is a choice; God made a choice that those that rejected Him.  And that’s the power of this wonderful love you must receive it.  God doesn’t come upon you and take your will away; because that isn’t how God works.  It’s a love that will not offend you and making you believe and step into.  It’s a love that will bring judgment to all men; no doubt about it.  But it must be entered into by saying “Here I am take me.”

Sid: You know I’m convinced that when we get to heaven the big thing that Jesus will say to us is “Did you walk in love?”

Pat:  That’s it, you know in the parable Jesus says “Friend,” The parable of the wedding feast.  “Friend, where’s your wedding garment?”  Well God, Jesus the Father, is talking to a believer that’s cast out.  I don’t believe that he’s cast out to hell, but I think that God is calling each and every person that we’re all called.  You know our ministry is called in demonstration of phenomenal things they’re just phenomenal the Name of Jesus is.

Sid: Alright I want people to understand the power that you and your wife operate in.  Tell me you know that God has really used you with people with AIDS tell me one person, perhaps someone dying of AIDS.

Pat:  How about 3 people.

Sid: Okay.

Pat:  In the hospital our pastor was giving us a ride…

Sid: Look give me 100 people; just be healed. (Laughing)

Pat:  He’d received a call, Pastor Tom had received a call and he said “Pat would you mind stopping at Fairfax Hospital this is in Washington D.C.  There’s a young man there with a family that the doctor gives about 12 hours to live and he has AIDS.  And I said “Yeah, you know let’s stop we’ve got time.”  And as we were walking into the hospital I was crying out to the Lord “Dear God.”  And the Lord said to me “I have sent you to set the captives free.”  And so they would only allow but one person in the room and I walked in and he was a precious Hispanic man.  And I said “Ormando, I am a bond servant, a disciple of the Lord Jesus Christ, He sent me in here and to lay my hand upon you and God will raise you up out of this bed and He’s going to heal you in 3 minutes.”  And he had these huge tuberculosis tumors, and folks I don’t know of many people that have not seen or smelled death this man was gray and he could barely open up his eyes he was in excruciating pain but he had no breath. These tumors were pressing on his throat and his lungs.  As I laid my hand on the tumor it vaporized and there was 4 of them.  And pretty soon he started screaming because his breath was coming back. And then I rebuked the spirit of death of AIDS and the spirit of pain.  Laid my hands on his forehead and anointed him and he leaped out of his gurney, literally it was awesome.  And he threw his hands up in the air and started jumping and repenting and shouting the Lordship of Jesus.  Now this young man was radically raised from the dead, I mean he was still breathing but he was as good as dead. Another man…

Sid: But did you see the tumors vaporize before your eyes?

Pat:  Absolutely it was like my hand touched it and then fell all the way to the normal chest.  They were as big as two fists together.

Sid: How long did all of this take?

Pat:  Under 3 minutes.

Sid: Hmm.

Pat: The next man was a young man who came to a healing conference that I had in Baltimore; he sat in the backroom he was just like a walking skeleton.  Many times God’s speaking to me as I preach and so I’m waiting for the Holy Ghost to move people, I’m always waiting for the Holy Spirit to do it.

Sid: Me too, and I get confused when I’m trying to talk my thoughts and listen to God at the same time.  I have to stop; God you’re in charge.

Pat:  So, finally this young man came up and started to cry and I said “Don’t be ashamed come here.”  I said “Are you ready to receive Jesus as your Lord and Savior?”  He had no faith; I mean he had faith but he had no expectations of God healing him period.  But he received Jesus and when I lead somebody in the prayer to receive the Messiah they receive all the gifts and they get baptized with His fire and the power of God came and he fell back on the floor over the tremendous power of God and just laid there.  And I leaned over and loosed the spirit of AIDS or death off of him, cast it off.  And I said “Young man, by the strips of Jesus Christ this very day you’ve been healed, and 45 minutes later or so he was able to get off the floor.  And I said “Now, go get your blood tested and the Lord’s healed you.”  He had an appointment on Monday or Tuesday I forget, this was a Sunday, and they got the results back a week after that and he said “The doctor kept running in and out of the room.”  (Laughing) There was no trace, and he had a double testing, not only did he have late stage HIV but he also had contracted brain AIDS induced meningitis and there was nothing, pure.  The blood was absolutely totally pure, the young man’s put 65 pounds on. And then a few weeks ago we were in South Carolina in our tent and Henry was a street person; a precious black man and I’ll never forget Henry’s smile because all he had was teeth on the side.  He was just precious.  And he came up, and he sat in the back and finally after preaching we were ministering and he came up.  And there was just tears and sobbing and he said “Could God forgive me again, could I come back?”  And I said “Oh Henry, how the Lord loves you.”  So I led him in a prayer to recommit his life and I laid my hands on him and I rebuked that demon of AIDS. Henry had sores all over his body, all over puss, it was awful.  And he had come to the meeting evidently to see if he could get $15 for a bus ticket if you could image this to go to his mother’s funeral.  Pastor Glen the next day gave him a ride to the bus depot and Henry sat there smiling.  And said Pastor Glen, “Have you notice anything?”  And Pastor Glen said “No Henry what are you talking about?”  And he said “Look, I have no more sores on my body, that’s the Jesus I know.”

Sid: Hm. Let me ask you something, have you ever seen a Messianic Miracle?  A Messianic Miracle is someone born blind that gets their sight.

Pat:  Yes.

Sid: Tell me one.

Pat:  This year in Diwali, Africa there was a sister that came up in a public meeting to receive prayer and she was partly paralyzed and she couldn’t walk.  And the Lord immediately healed her; I mean immediately healed her.  And this was a French speaking country, and so I don’t speak French so as I’m observing her not using my prophetic gifts I realized that there’s no pupil there’s nothing.  And so through the interpreter I said “Ask this dear sister if she would like Jesus to heal her blindness?”  And she had to think about it a minute and finally she said “Oui.”  So I could just feel the increase of the presence of God so I laid my hand on her left eye.  And I said “Father, in Jesus Name I ask for a creation miracle and I pulled my hand away.”  And I said to the interpreter “Tell her to open her eyes.” And so she opened her eyes and covered the right eye and I said “What is it that she sees?”  And through the interpreter she says “You look like a tree.”  And so I got pretty excited about that so I prayed again and this time I said “Father I thank you for the completed created miracle in Jesus Name.”  Holy Spirit I charge You and force the Covenant to come to life.” And I pulled my hand away quickly because I’d been waiting to see myself; God I’ve seen tremendous miracles but I’ve never seen an eye recreated.”  And as quick as quick as I pulled my hand away I saw a cloud a vapor cloud form around, swirl around her left eye.  And I saw the pupil being created (Laughing).

Sid: My goodness we’re out of time today but tomorrow’s broadcast I’m going to have Patrick and his wife Patty pray for you.  Get ready for a miracle Roman’s 11 says “Salvation has come to the Gentile to provoke the Jew to jealousy.” What are you doing; this is the time that the spiritual blindness has coming off the eyes of the Jewish people.  This is the time for the emergence of one new man.  This is the time for the race to save the world.

Sid:  Let me tell you some good news; we are proclaiming the gospel in the largest Jewish populated city in the world, New York City; secular television; prime time.  Listen to this we just went on RNN TV which is carried on the Time Warner Cable in New York City, Manhattan channel number 91.  We’re on Monday nights at 9:30 pm; the Time Warner cable has 4.2 million households or 93% of New York’s total cable households.  And the RNN it’s self covers New York City, Hudson Valley, as well as New Jersey.  So as far as I’m concerned to be on secular radio in New York City at this strategic, strategic moment in which God is removing the spiritual scales on the eyes of Jewish people.  And I want to have the money to pay for this and God is going to provide it. We took a step out in faith; we are debt free but I believe God told us to go on this station and I want to have the money to have advertisements in New York City newspapers directing Jewish people to watch “It’s Supernatural Television” where they will see miracles such as the guest I have on the telephone right now. His name is Bill Kent I’m speaking to him at his home in Blue Ridge Summit, Pennsylvania.  This is without a doubt one of the most verified medical miracles I have ever seen in almost 30 years investigating miracles.  Bill was in an accident; hard to believe he had a motorcycle accident with a train in May of 1985.  He had closed head injuries, massive traumatic brain damage, spinal injuries, ruptured optic nerve, cardiac arrest; he was comatose for 3 months the doctor said “There’s no hope.”  Quadriplegic, in a wheelchair and he’s about ready to commit suicide, he had all sorts of turmoil going on his life.  You can understand this; how many years were you in the wheelchair Bill?

Bill:  Fifteen and a half years;

Sid: Fifteen and a half years. He actually was involved in the Wheelchair Olympics and he won 39 Gold Metals in shooting. But he heard a voice and the voice said go to Columbus, Ohio on a specific date, November 5^th.  So he just didn’t know what but this voice kept repeating itself day after day; November 5^th go to Columbus, Ohio.  And so he turns on the TV channel surfing and he catches Rod Parsley, he’s never seen him before and Rod’s talking it’s an infomercial on a Debt Burning Service.  But it’s like the Holy Spirit said “That’s the place and it’s in Columbus, Ohio where I’m sending you,” but he didn’t have any money. And his church took up an offering and he went to Columbus, Ohio. It just turns out on November 5^th there happens to be a Miracle Healing Service.  So he wheels himself in; he had already talked to someone on the telephone getting some instructions and the person prayed for him. And for the first time he felt burning in his feet; he knew God was up to something; and so he goes in wheels into the church and what happened next Bill.

Bill: Well, after we entered the sanctuary the service began and the director of praise and worship came out and made the announcement “It was going to be a miracle faith and healing service, but there couldn’t be any unbelief in the house.” So he said “If you can’t believe or you don’t believe then he’d have to ask you to leave. and I saw a few people get up and leave.  Well praise the Lord for that because the next thing that happened Pastor Parsley came out you know after the praise and worship for about an hour and hour and half Pastor Parsley comes out.  And he says that “The Lord had woken him in the wee hours of the morning and told him that there was somebody coming from far away on the promise that he would be healed.” Well my spirit just absolutely leapt you know because that was me; you know I had come from far away on the promise that I’d be healed.  So the service goes on and you know Pastor calls the first thing that happens pastor calls the homosexuals down, blows my mind. He commands the church in prayer over these homosexuals that they be set free.  It’s unlike anything that I’d ever experienced before; the unity in prayer in that church was incredible.  There were over 7,000 people in that church that night and to command prayer where 7,000 people come into unity like that it was incredible.  The service goes on; he then calls the diabetics down and that’s me because I’m a diabetic.

Sid: In addition to everything else (Laughing)

Bill:  Yes.

Sid: Okay.

Bill:  The parking lot just before entering the church I tested my blood sugar. Now I had not had insulin for 3 days I ran out and couldn’t afford to buy any.  So my blood sugar tested in the parking lot was 470.  Normal blood sugar is between 80 and 140 once you get above 140 you’re in trouble.  Mine was 470; so I go down front with my dog and you know I’m sitting there and prayer is going on and the church comes into such unity again but I don’t feel anything.  Pastor Parsley said this is for only the diabetics so if you’re down here and you don’t have diabetes go back to your seat and wait.  Well, a few minutes went by and then he said “The Holy Ghost just said ‘If you have way feel that you’re going to be healed of anything you had better get down here.’” So with that 1000’s came down front the prayers went on, general prayer for healing for all kinds of different infirmities, carpal tunnel syndrome, cancer, HIV, back pain, knee pain, all kinds of things.  And I started seeing miracles unfold; I started seeing blind eyes opened.  I started seeing deaf ears pop, and people beginning to hear, I saw chronic back pain you know gone. I saw cancer gone, I saw visible tumors disappear right before my eyes. It’s incredible absolutely positively incredible. So you know it’s like the service is going on and on and on and on.  And it seems to me like it’s getting towards the end of the service and you know I’m starting to feel a little bit let down. I just cry out to God. I said “God, You told me to come to Columbus, Ohio, and You told me to come to Columbus, Ohio and I’d be healed but I don’t feel anything.  And so it’s like “I know You’re not a liar, I know that You’re a God of Your word; and this is what You told me to do so You better do something.”  And with that I went to adjust myself in my wheelchair and one of ushers his name is Jerry Moore, he was standing to my left. Jerry leaned over and he says, “Are you trying to get out of that chair?”  And what I wanted to say was “No, I’m just adjusting myself” but before I could say anything words came out of my mouth “I’m going to jump out this chair in 30 seconds.”

Sid: My goodness when it came out of your mouth what did you think?

Bill:  I didn’t know what to think I was you know, in shock and awe.

Sid:  Did you get up?

Bill:  I did 30 seconds later I was standing up and Jerry the usher the only thing that kept him from hitting the floor was that there was a knee wall behind him that caught his fall.  And so he started you know praising God you know and said “Can you walk?”  And I said “I don’t know this is the first time I stood in 15½ years.  So he said “Take 3 steps forwards and 3 steps back” and before I knew it I had done it.  And then he says to me he says “Can you walk up those steps onto the platform?”  And I you know just held my hands up and said “I don’t know let’s ask God.”  And before I knew it I was on the platform.

Sid: How did you get there?

Bill: I don’t know.

Sid: (Laughing)

Bill: God knows.

Sid: How many years since you’ve been able to walk?

Bill:  Fifteen ½ years.

Sid: Here let me read this to you Mishpochah by the way he got his blood sugar down to normal; he actually tested it while he was there.  He is not crippled in any way and let me read from doctor, he’s the M.D. Dr. Horns report which I have right here. “Mr. Kent has been supernaturally healed and there is no medical or scientific explanation for what has taken place.  He went in a quadriplegic with diabetes and a few other things and he walked out; he walked out.”  What did you do with your wheelchair?

Bill:  Well, I still have it because that wheelchair is part of my testimony but I don’t use it.  And I have not used it since that night.

Sid: Okay Mishpochah how would you like to have this testimony covering all the Jewish people and all the gentile people in all of New York City.  I just told you by faith I went on a secular station and they cover 4.2 million households; New York City, Hudson Valley, Connecticut, New Jersey. I need help.  I need you to pray for this ministry; I tell you this is God’s time to remove the spiritual scales from the eyes of Jewish people.

Sid:  Now my guest is a Jewish believer his name is David Herzog and he is saying by faith what I am saying by faith but it is faith based on the written word of God, and faith on what the Spirit of God is telling us.  David do you see a major revival of Jewish people taking place in Israel?

David:  Yes, right now I believe that we’re on the verge of something fresh and new that’s just starting in its infancy to touch people in Israel in a power powerful way I have not seen it in many years.

Sid:  And you know there’s a scripture that says “The Word of the Lord will go forth from Zion.”  Now it’s not without precedence the first move started in Israel; why shouldn’t the greatest move of God of God’s Spirit in history before this whole thing is wrapped up start in Israel?

David: Well yeah because the Bible does say you know the disciples “When will all these things happen, when will the end come?”  And Yeshua said it clearly He said “Not until Israel says ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord.’”  So even if you win every nation of the earth to God but we don’t focus on Israel, He’s still not returning.

Sid: So tell me this “Why are there people that are actually moving in the power of God and either they’re in replacement theology meaning the church has replaced Israel or they say  well I see a place for Israel but I don’t see any special emphasis.”  I don’t understand why they’re getting manifestations of healings.

David:  Yes, it’s hard it’s a hard thing to understand; I think that it’s just a lack of revelation; a lot of time people don’t have an understanding or a revelation. I’ve known a pastor for many years and he was replacement theology and we’re still friends but he had appreciated our ministry and finally he said to me “Brother, man I see the blessing, the favor, the miracles; how is this happening?”  And I told him, “You know what, just come with me to Israel I don’t want to argue with you just come on a trip.” He came on a trip and within about 48 hours he understood the revelation of God touched him and now he’s being blessed.

Sid: Well, here’s what I believe the ones that are moving in the power of God you see “The gifts and calling of God are without repentance.”  You stand in His Name by faith you’ll see the miraculous. What I foresee about ready to happen and you foresee is way beyond a headache; I literally see someone without a leg getting their leg back.  Has God shown these things to you?

David:  That amazing you’re saying that because I was just thinking about one story.  In France we had a big big campaign, glory meeting, miracle meeting. Two people in wheelchairs and instantly walked and they were just healed without anybody laying hands on them.  But a third man he left the meeting early he was paralyzed he left with his wife and they went into the car drove to the hotel about midnight. The paralyzed man the husband stayed in the car and while she was getting the keys in the hotel a thief came and stole the car with him in it.  Not very fun to steal a car with the owner in it.  And the seat-belt well it wrapped around…

Sid: Sounds like a bad movie but go ahead.

David: Yeah, and the thief tried to kick the paralyzed man out the door and he managed to kick him out while the car was moving and the seat-belt wrapped around his leg or something had happened and literally cut off his leg. So he’s paralyzed and now he’s missing a leg; he’s laying on the cement on the highway or the roadway and the ambulance come and take him to the doctor.  They grafted the leg back together but you know as well as I do even if you have a good leg and that happens it’s ripped off like that it’s not a good chance you’re going to walk.  So they grafted it back; I didn’t know that happened and that night I prayed for handkerchiefs I said “Some of you have friends or family that are not here; look at these miracles and pray for these handkerchiefs send them to people that are sick.”  And one lady brought it to the man in the hospital the next day or so and laid it on his leg and began praying and the power of God came on his legs.  Just got out of surgery and they had tried to graft it back; electricity came all over his legs.  He began wiggling his toes and his feet and he was paralyzed for one and now he had just gotten his leg put back together after being cut off.  That’s a big miracle; within 5 days he walked out of the hospital; he’s still healed today he’s no longer paralyzed.

Sid: Hmm, David explain to our people when the glory shows up; I mean have you ever experienced the glory where it’s almost like a tangible cloud that you can touch and you can even see?

David: Yes we’ve even had that happen; I was in a meeting one time in Ashland, Virginia preaching when Ruth Heflin was there. The cloud of glory was so thick. I went outside towards the end of the meeting I walked outside through the back door because I was on the stage; when I looked in you couldn’t see the people there was a literal physical cloud.  Others started walking outside as well to look at it and they couldn’t believe it and it was literally from the outside looking in it was a cloud you couldn’t see the people; it was amazing.

Sid: Explain to me, what is the difference between ministering the anointing of God and the glory of God?

David:  Oh, I love that question, yeah big difference; you could be ministering under the anointing of God that God gave you. You know you’re laying hands on the sick and let’s say there’s 1,000 people and you’re starting to lay hands and 3 or 4 people get healed.  But you know it’s going to take you a long time to touch everybody, but when the glory of God comes in the building it’s like Acts Chapter 4 “It says Lord stretch out Your hands to heal.” And that’s when Peter’s shadow began healing the sick, so when the glory comes in many times you don’t have to go and pray personally for each person there’s like a mass healing thing that happens because His hand is being stretched out.  And that’s where I’ve see the most creative miracles, the most amount of miracles in a 5 minute period I could see several hundred miracles as opposed to me one and one trying to pray for each one and find out what happened.  So the glory is an accelerator whatever you can do in the anointing you can do it way faster in the glory realm

Sid: Well, I want to explain something that’s going on in my ministry and maybe you can give me some insight.  When I first started I would get words of knowledge like say a back and I didn’t know what to do with it I just hear that just out of the blue and that’s how I began to recognize “Oh, that’s coming from God, that’s not coming from me.”  So I would say “Everyone with a back problem come forward” and they would come forward and I would lay hands on them and everyone would be healed.

David: Hmm.

Sid: Then I began to see that if I would just speak that word out people didn’t have to come forward; they could get healed in there seat and so I did that.  Then I began to see that once one person was healed of anything; anyone could be healed of anything.

David:  Hmm.

Sid: In other words people are waiting for me to say a specific word of their condition to trigger their faith to receive; but what I try to tell people is the minute I have one word, my first word the glory is there and grab what you need.

David:  Exactly.

Sid:  Now is this what you’re experiencing?

David: Yeah, exactly what happens is you’ll get one or two words or whatever to start but then it triggers a reaction when people realize wait God’s here and they on their own just start receiving their miracles while the glory is there.  Many times it happens that people just drive by the church building and get their miracle and their not even saved.  So the glory of God is not just limited like you said to you giving a word; sometimes that just encourages their faith to get it started for them to believe.  And the Bible says “My sheep hear My voice,” so they also can hear God’s voice for the healing and the miracles while the glory is happening.  And many many times there’s things that we never prayed for.  I was in Versailles, France on the day the Tsunami hit. A lady just jumped out of her wheelchair; I never called out paralyzed and the glory was so thick she just full of faith and knowing the presence was there just got up and jumped into that glory and she was instantly healed.

Sid: Now you actually proclaimed that people could be transported in the Spirit; explain that.

David:  Hmm, this is going to be fun.  Yeah, in fact let me give you a quick testimony about 2 or 3 weeks ago I was driving to Belgium from Paris and my car broke down about 7:30 the meeting starts at 7:00 I still had 3 more hours to drive.  So I called the pastor and said “I’m not going to make it I’ll be there about 10.”  As I got in the car the Holy Spirit began to tell me about transportation; He said “That which you have been preaching and you’ve seen before I’m going to do it again.”  And I thought is this just me or the Lord, even though we’re in this realm we’ll still sometimes wonder.  And as I’m driving and worshiping the Lord I was there within 45 minutes I saw the exit to the place that I needed to be in Belgium and I was there within 45 minutes.  So that’s one example and when I showed up the church was shocked; the pastor was shocked because they had just finished the worship and I was able to preach.  So I was there way ahead of time; you can be transported on the earth; you can also be transported to heaven; third heaven.

Sid:  Now I was talking specifically about French Guiana where you made a declaration that there would be heavenly visitations; what happened?

David:  Yeah, we were doing a meeting in the… it looked like a jungle area. That night the pastor and I were talking about how great with God was moving in the meeting and wasn’t that great to see the people being touched. And as we were talking that night we had an angelic visitation; we both were visit by angels to about 4:00 in the morning, which at that point I had never had that happen with another person.  Then the next day flew over to the capital city; shared the experience of what God had done and two people that we know for sure; there were others.  But especially one was the pastor’s daughter she’d just got knocked out by the power of God on her own no one touching her. And they carried her home to her friend’s house she was about 16; her friend was also knocked out like in a trance kinda state where they couldn’t wake her up.  And the mother of the friend began listening to the pastor’s daughter talking in the trance like state and saying “I don’t want to come back, I don’t want to come back.”  When she came back to finally she explained about how she’d been to Heaven and saw Jesus, Yeshua, and saw her best friend. The mom said that “If this is true we’re going to try to wake up your best friend out of this trance and see if this stories real.”  She had just said she had saw Yeshua and her best friend in Heaven.  Woke up the other friend finally out of the trance and the girl said “Mom I was just in Heaven with her.”  And the mom said “Well, what did you talk about she said you had a conversation together in Heaven.”  It was exact same conversation, exact same experience that they both shared.  So yeah, these things are real; there is Heaven and you can visit it.  We had it happen recently while in Israel where half our tour group actually were taken to the third Heaven right at Bethel the place where it all happened.

Sid: Well, let me ask you something if on say I turn you loose tomorrow to preach on this subject of the glory and you also preach a little bit on Friday’s broadcast what do you believe could happen to people as God’s Glory is released that are just listening to us?

David: Yeah, I believe that as they listen and as they’re being touched and open first of all there will be a lot of miracles, healings, creative miracles, maybe signs and wonders anything can happen. There can be people that have angelic visitation.

Sid: Okay, consider yourself challenged Mishpochah.