Sid Roth

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here. Welcome to my world where it’s naturally supernatural. My guest Perry Stone, since age 16, has been studying Heaven, End Times. He has spent well over 100,000 hours and he has come up with revelations that as far as scholars are concerned, no one has ever come up with before about Heaven and End Times. He even has come up with a revelation about the 2016 presidential election. Anyone interested? You know, when I found out that Perry Stone was working on the subject of Heaven and New Jerusalem, I got so excited. I can’t even tell you why I got so excited, but I got so excited I had to have him on this show. But I’m told an event occurred when you were 16 years of age that started you on this quest.

PERRY: Salem High School, it was a high school in southern Virginia, a boy came up to me at 16 years of age, I was 16, and I was preaching at that time just as a kid preacher. And I had a big Bible with me, and he said, “Preacher man, what are you going to do when you die and find out there’s not a Heaven?” I was always real quick to answer and I said, “Jimmy, what you gonna do when you die and find out there’s a hell?” And then, but what happened is it stirred and I thought, how would I prove to somebody, kind of more from a scientific perspective that there is a place called Heaven. And so that’s what really started my journey and it was just, it’s been exciting to, even over the years, even recently to add more to what God showed me.

SID: You got revelations. We’re going to share some of them. But here’s what I want you to help me with and I think you’re going to help a lot of other people. Take me, very briefly, on a prophetic timeline starting where we are right now.

PERRY: Okay. Right now we’re in the church age, which is called the dispensation of the grace of God. It will continue and climax at the time of the Rapture. Now I lean toward pre-trib because of a lot of research over the years that we have done. Now let’s just assume this is correct. Then what we have at that point is a tribulation period, which in Daniel 9:27 is set for seven years. It’s divided into 42 months and 42 months. And what would happen is the return of the Lord, and I like to say for the overcoming saints who are looking for him. When that happens, it triggers a time of tribulation on the earth, which is a total of seven years. During the seven years the saints will begin having, getting rewards and also we will enjoy what’s called a Marriage Supper of the Lamb during the seven years in Heaven. On Earth, there is judgment, there’s the revelation of the Antichrist, there’s the Mark of the Beast. There’s a lot of population of the earth that is eliminated by, some of it’s just natural calamities, asteroids, earthquakes, etc. We come to the end of the tribulation. We have the Lord returning, Revelation 19 says, “On a white horse is King of King and Lord of Lords.” And then he sets up his kingdom in Jerusalem for a thousand years. That’s where we get the word “millennial reign”. That’s a thousand. And during that thousand years the saints of God are going to rule on Earth with him for a thousand years. At the end of it, Satan is loosed for a season. Now the only reason he loosed, Sid, because this has perplexed people, why don’t God keep him bound? Because in the millennial reign there will be people on Earth who will continue to repopulate the earth that have never been tempted, tested or tried by Satan. So God is going to let earthly people who are living in the tribulation, who have survived being repopulated to be tested to see if they’re going to be faithful to the Lord or follow Satan. That’s the last test. Then when that is over, the Bible tells us there’s a Great White Throne of Judgment in Heaven and then Satan is bound forever in the lake of fire, which is going to be a tremendous day for everyone who is a believer, of course. The new Heaven and new Earth come down after the Great White Throne of Judgment. This judgment, every single angel that’s fallen, Satan himself, plus all saints, all unbelievers, all are in Heaven at one time. Now we’ve already been judged as believers as the judgment seat of Christ. Okay. That’s in Revelation, Chapter 11. But the world and the sinners have not been judged. God is never going to condemn anyone to an eternity without him, in let’s say the lake of fire, without them absolutely seeing and knowing the reason why. That’s why there’s a Great White Throne of Judgment.

SID: You know, Perry, you teach on the mysteries, unlocking the mysteries of Heaven, past, present and future. Explain.

PERRY: The Holy Spirit put something together for me that I had never heard taught in my life. I believe it can be proven, from Ezekiel 28, from the Book of Revelation, from Isaiah 14, that Lucifer, who we know is Satan, before he fell, was assisting God in the building of the New Jerusalem. The fall of Lucifer took place before the New Jerusalem was completed, and I’ll get into that later. Now that’s called the ages past. Creation as we know it with man is 6000. What a lot of people don’t realize is there’s what’s called ages past, and ages past was, okay, when was Lucifer created, when were the angels created. He was in Heaven as a cherub before he fell. When was that? When did the rebellion take place where he took a third of the angels and they fell with him? That’s the ages past part. In fact, I’m going to throw a nugget out here to all your folks. In the Bible it says Hell was prepared for the devil and his angels, but when was Hell prepared? Scientists say that the earth was at one time molten fire and water cool[ed it], and that’s how the process began. In Genesis 1:1, the earth is created perfect. You studied Hebrew. You know that, “In the beginning God created the Heaven and the Earth.” The tense there is complete perfection, like a perfect, it’s done.

SID: Right.

PERRY: Verse 2, “Everything is without form and void.” The fall of Lucifer happened between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 in ages past.

SID: So in ages past there is a gap and we don’t even know how long that was.

PERRY: Thankyou. That’s exactly what I’m saying. We don’t know how long the gap is. And that explains, if I can, the controversy as to why Christians say there’s a 6000-year old earth, scientists say it’s a four billion-year old earth.

SID: There’s an answer to everything.

PERRY: There absolutely is an answer if we understand the fall of Lucifer and the gap in Genesis 1:1 and 1:2, and the timeframe there.

SID: Let’s go to some basics.

PERRY: Yes.

SID: Where is Heaven located?

PERRY: If you look at Isaiah, Chapter 14, Satan says, “I will descend into Heaven above the stars of God and above the clouds in the sides of the north.” The northern part of Heaven is very unique because there’s a star there called the North Star or Polaris, which sits just a little bit off of true north. Anytime you needed direction you had to find the North Star. Anytime a ship needed direction you find the North Star. It’s the directional star. What is interesting, Job said, “God stretches the north over the empty place, but he hangs the earth on nothing.” Two scientific facts there, this what I learned when I was 16. One is the earth is hanging on nothing, but what’s this thing about the north being an empty place? I have a friend of mine, I have several friends who work for NASA and they say it’s really true that in the northern part of the heavens there is an empty place and there’s a gap. It’s just an empty, a darkness, a gap. All right. The Bible indicates that. North is the only place where you look, really, true up. All right. So Heaven is in the north. Now number two, Isaiah said, it was Satan talking, but Isaiah wrote it, “I’ll send above the clouds, above the stars in the sides to the north.” That’s three heavens. Paul in Second Corinthians—

SID: I heard about Second Heaven. How many heavens are there?

PERRY: The Bible tells you of three. There are three heavens and the Bible indicates specifically what those three are: clouds, stars then the end of the stars, that begins the Third Heaven, and that’s where God dwells is in the Third Heaven.

SID: And where does the devil dwell and his demons?

PERRY: Let me say it this way. Adam was given dominion over the fowls of the air. The birds if you ever see them fly in the sky near the clouds, so Adam, man has dominion of the First Heaven. That’s why we have airplanes that aren’t falling out of the sky. The devil is not knocking airplanes out of the sky. We can fly. We have dominion. We have satellites. Number two, however, is Satan rules in the realm of the Second Heaven. Principalities, rulers of darkness in high places are in Second Heaven. Third Heaven is where God rules. So it’s interesting how that between where we are to where God is we have this spiritual warfare going on. Here’s the part that just absolutely stuns me. I love this part. Jesus, when he returns, doesn’t come back up in the stars, and we have to meet him where the stars are. He comes right back into Satan’s territory and snatches us out so fast that the enemy doesn’t even know it’s happened until it’s over with.

SID: I’m going to tell you something. I want you to talk about never revealed. No scholars have ever heard this. Revelations, you have God about the mountain in Heaven, the stones in Heaven, about Lucifer. We’ll be right back.

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here. Welcome to my world where it’s naturally supernatural. My guest had cancer three times. Nothing the doctors could do for him. In desperation he went to Oral Roberts just before Oral was promoted to Heaven. Oral prayed for him. His cancer went away, but he got something new, the supernatural gift of faith and he wants to impart that to you. Anyone want it? Okay, I have James Goll here. He’s a good friend. I’ve known him many years. I trust his prophetic word. That’s why the devil tried to take him out. Thirty times he gets cancer. Doctors say there’s nothing they can do. In desperation he goes to Oral Roberts and asks for prayer. What happened?

JAMES: Well it was an amazing encounter, a God encounter. And so went from Nashville, Tennessee with a white mask on. My white blood count was dangerously low. There was nothing more the doctors could do, my third bout with non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma cancer. So to tell a story short, then towards the end of the time in his home I was sitting on this little ottoman at the chair where Oral Roberts was sitting and he laid his hands on me.

SID: You’re provoking me to jealousy. I wanted to go there. I never made it.

JAMES: I really wanted to be there, too, and so, and I wasn’t even on the list to get invited, and I heard about it, and I said, God I want to be there. And then all at the last moment I got invited, so I got your invitation. Okay.

SID: Wait a second.

JAMES: God does things for desperate people. Okay. It was something like that. So here I am in Oral Roberts’ home and then towards the end if you wanted prayer you could be prayed for. Well I wanted prayer. That’s what I went for. And I thought, I really believed in my knower that I was going to be the last person that Oral Roberts would pray for that would get healed. I’m sitting there and he says, “I want you to know I have never prayed for anyone for longer than 15 seconds.” And I’m going, “I don’t care. One second will work.” And so he lays his hands on me, and he said this, and it’s marked in memory for all the days of my life. And he laid his hands upon on me, and he said, “I eradicate every cancer cell in your body and I command it to never come back again.” And I felt like a lightning bolt of the presence of God went down on the inside of me. It was amazing. And something happened. Guess what happened?

SID: I know what happened.

JAMES: What happened?

SID: You got healed.

JAMES: I got healed.

SID: But now you know me. I am just so curious about God. I get so excited about God.

JAMES: Right.

SID: What did it really, you said lightning bolt. I know that word. Did it really feel that way?

JAMES: I don’t know else to say it. It was an energizing power, presence of the Holy Spirit. It was external and then with his laying of hands it went and deposited in me, in me. And what I actually believe it was, was the gift of faith.

SID: Okay. So you got a double thing. The cancer went out.

JAMES: That’s right.

SID: And this gift of faith went in. Had you ever had such a gift like this?

JAMES: No. I had moved in discerning of spirits on a regular basis. I moved in prophecy for 30-some years and different gifts of the spirit. But I would say that that was not one of my strong points and I had not really regularly functioned in the gift of faith. But I ended up at doctors. My white blood count was supernaturally raised. My blood count was all fine after this and I go back, to this day, once a year for a checkup and seven years later the cancer has never come back. And guess what? It’s never coming back again.

SID: I agree. Now I know you have faith for people that have cancer to pray for them. But you have something new that I’m excited about. I’m so excited. This same supernatural gift of faith that was imparted to him from the laying of hands of Oral Roberts, he by speaking can impart that to other people. Now you recently had downloaded a teaching that is really revolutionary on gifts of the Spirit. Tell me about this.

JAMES: Oh my goodness.

SID: Tell me about when it happened. I want to know that.

JAMES: Well actually it’s been a deposit over years. And like many people you sit under teaching and then it builds up and builds up, and builds up, and being a teacher myself and a pastor in the past, and recognized as a prayer and prophet leader. So there’s been this build-up. But then I go to teach this material and I go to teach it all over again and the Lord gives me a dream, and I’m going out, and I’m saying to the Lord, I’m saying, Lord, there’s a piece missing. There’s a piece missing. I know you have the piece. What is the piece? And I get this, and it comes to me so clear and simple, and it was releasing spiritual gifts today. And the Holy Spirit emphasized the word “today” and the word “today” resonated on the inside of me, and then I understood Hebrews 11:1 better. “Now faith is.” Faith isn’t about yesterday nor is it projected to the future. Now it is present. It is present tense. Now faith is. And that’s how spiritual gifts are, releasing, receiving and releasing spiritual gifts, when? Yesterday? Thank God for everything that’s gone on in the past. Thank God for what’s going to happen in the future, but how about faith for the release of spiritual gifts today.

SID: Well faith is always now and that’s what you do with your teaching. Everything you teach is not by the time you develop your muscles, your spiritual muscles. It’s now. I like it. I think God is in a hurry. I think God wants to show him some before people that don’t know him and what happens if all believers are equipped to demonstrate the Kingdom, the signs and wonders. In fact, define to me “spiritual gifts.”

JAMES: Well they’re not natural talents. Some people think that you get like a gift that matches your personality. Not necessarily, really. Okay. Sometimes, but no. It’s supernatural. I think there’s a television show that’s out today and I have this friend, and he wears these like bright ties sometimes.

SID: All the time.

JAMES: A different one on every show and it’s called something like “It’s Supernatural.” Well the spiritual gifts are that way, Sid. They’re not natural. They’re supernatural ability of God that he deposits by grace and they’re free gifts that he gives to his people to demonstrate his love through them to others.

SID: Briefly tell me about an example of using these gifts, like in Albania.

JAMES: Awesome. Oh well. Right after communism had lifted and I was one of the first people into Albania and I had ministered in the capitol in Tirana for a while, they take me up the coast, and it’s dark, it’s raining. I’m on the cliff overlooking the Adriatic Sea and I’m saying, O God, O God, O God, what do you have for these ancient Shqiperian people? And a word floats to my mind and it is “Sarah.” There was no worship. It was a cold building. It was raining. It was not a good atmosphere. It was like January. And so I’m up there and I had to talk with my interpreter, and, oh my goodness, it didn’t seem like I was getting very far. So we cried help. But guess what? The helper answers and he says to me, and he reminds me, “Sarah.” So I turned to my interpreter and I said, “How do you say Sarah in Shqiperian He says, “Sabrina.” So then I speak and the interpreter interprets, and I try to tell this. And I said, “Is there a Sabrina here?” Place is packed. Everybody knows everybody. No one is a believer. And so one lady stands in the back, and I go, Praise God, Hallelujah Jesus. Sabrina was there. So she stands. So I say, “Sabrina, come to the front.” She’s now standing there. Words of knowledge are coming to me. “Your name is Sabrina. You have never heard the Gospel of Jesus Christ in your lifetime. You’re 32 years old. You have a tumor in your left breast and Jesus wants to heal you.”

SID: That’s called stepping out.

JAMES: Yes it was. And guess what? Her name was Sabrina. She had never heard Jesus. She had a thick winter coat. She had cancer and a tumor in her left breast. She gets healed, saved, delivered all right then in front of everybody.

SID: I’m going to tell you something. When we come back James has revelation on the working of miracles. I want him to teach about that. Be right back.

SID: Now LaDonna teaches the same truths her parents taught. Her son teaches the same truths she taught. But these are Osborns. Do you teach just regular people these same truths? And here’s the big question, do they get the same results?

LaDONNA: Yes. Yes. Every place we go, what we do is done in such a way that the people there understand that this is the ideal of God’s life for them. And they go everywhere. They scatter, praying for the sick, seeing miracles, winning souls, building churches.

SID: You know, I’m in favor of supernatural gifting. I operate in supernatural gifting. But what LaDonna is teaching is for everyone. LaDonna, tell me about a creative miracle that’s one of your favorites from your prayers.

LaDONNA: This little boy, six years old, was born without a kneecap. He never walked. He heard on the radio that there were miracles happening at this Festival of Faith and Miracles, and so he told his father, “Take me there and I’ll be healed.” So the father put the child on his shoulders and walked, did the trek to the crusade grounds. And did you know that the moment that father’s feet touched the grounds, that little boy just said, “Okay, put me down.” Now that’s faith. Expecting matter of factly that something, like the woman in the Bible, “When I touch him, I’ll be made clean.” We can declare the time for our miracle. He said, “Put me down.” So the father put him down. That child had a kneecap, a creative miracle. He was running all around. He never heard a sermon. He never heard a prayer. But he believed in the miracle power of Jesus Christ.

SID: I’m going to challenge you right now. Here’s my challenge. I am going to turn LaDonna loose to teach just as she teaches at one of these campaigns and you will become like a little child. Only believe. All things are possible to those who believe. LaDonna.

LaDONNA: You see, when we teach everywhere in the world as I’m coming to you now, we begin by declaring that the Word of God is true, that God is not a liar, and that he has given promises. And he has demonstrated his good will through the example, the ministry of Jesus, God in the flesh who came to Earth. So important that we understand. And an example, and I love to give these examples when I minister globally, was the leper that came to Jesus in Matthew, chapter 8. You remember, he came and while we don’t understand the restrictions on lepers so much today, they had to live segregated. They couldn’t be around people. If they came near, they had to call out, “Unclean! Unclean!” Imagine declaring yourself unclean all the time. Depression, the demoralization of the leper in Jesus’ day. Well this leper, the Bible says, came to Jesus. Wow. So we start out by learning that we must come to Jesus without fear. And the man said to Jesus, listen to this, he said, “If you are willing, you are able to make me clean.” Now that’s a question that plagues so many Christians. That question becomes a hindrance to their miracle. They know that Jesus can do miracles. They know he has the power. They know he’s healed others. And yet, they’re not sure will he heal me. And that question becomes a block. Well we learn the answer by observing what Jesus did. He touched the leper. He was not afraid to be contaminated. My friend, he’ll touch you no matter what has contaminated your life or what issue you may be dealing with. He touched leper. That’s love. That’s power. And he said, these are the words, he said, “I want to. I’m willing. Be clean.” And the Bible says, immediately that man’s skin was healed. So you see, if we can just come to Jesus with faith, if we’re willing to expose even our unbelief to him and trust his answer, his answer is yes. And so we come to him, we lay our issue before him and we hear his yes. By faith then we receive. Can it be that simple? The scripture says, “I’m the Lord your healer.” Can you believe that, accept the yes of Jesus? Let me pray for you. Put your hand wherever you want Jesus to touch you. Heavenly Father, look at the people that come into with faith. Touch them where they’re touching themselves. May they feel your presence and may your healing life go through them now. I command every spirit of disease and infirmity to leave the people and do not come back. For you have been defeated by the resurrected Jesus. And now Lord, may your healing life flow through the people. In Jesus’ name, receive your healing. You are healed now. Say amen.

SID: I love medically documented miracles. Skeptics, where are you? Tell me about the Garza twins.

DON: The Garza twins attend our church. Their parents, Isaiah and Evangelina have gone to our church for several years. And when they discovered they were expecting twins, they started going through the normal process of going to the doctor’s appointments and that kind of thing. And pretty early on, they discovered that the twins had what is called twin-to-twin transfusion, where blood is passing back and forth between the twins.

SID: Is that dangerous?

DON: That’s very dangerous. It’s almost always fatal to at least one of the children and usually to both of the children. And as they walked through that process, they were advised by almost everybody that they saw to abort the pregnancy, and they chose not to do that.

SID: Even with that kind of a prognosis.

DON: Even with that kind of a prognosis. In fact, one day

SID: They have to be, you must be doing a good job if they’re in your church. You taught them right.

DON: Well I don’t know if I did a good job or they’re just smart people.

SID: Okay. So they went against the doctor’s advice.

DON: They did go against the advice of the medical community in not aborting the twins. They just chose to let God decide what would happen with their children. And so they continued with this pregnancy. And the longer it went, the more opinionated the advice became from the medical community that they should abort. And on a Sunday night in our church, we had a miracle healing service, and they came to that miracle healing service, and came up for prayer. And a lady in our church, one of my board member’s wives, Kim Hawthorne, prayed with them. And at the end of that prayer, she said to them, she said, “Go document this night because God has performed a miracle for you, and write down the date and the time, and what occurred because something has changed here.” And so when they went back to the doctor, the doctor as he’s doing the sonogram, he said, “Amazing, amazing. There’s baby one, there’s baby two and it appears that something has changed here. But yet, the diagnosis was that you still should expect that there is going to be some really severe consequences when these children are born.” But they knew at that time that the miracle had taken place, and we were believing that these twins would be born normal, and that they would live normal and healthy lives. And of course, the medical community believed that even if they were born, that they probably would not be able to live normal lives just because of all the things that go with the twin-twin transfusion.

SID: Now how old are they today and what do they look like?

DON: These children are ten years old today and they’re the picture of health.

SID: I want to go to Dr. Alexander Reiter. He’s a heart specialist at Texas Children’s Hospital, Houston Medical Center. Let’s go to that clip now.

[begin video]

Dr. Reiter: Follow this blood vessel. You see, it goes like this. And here connects with this one. So this was the main connection between the two. So blood from this one will go into this one and end up in the other baby or vice versa. What happened here at a certain point, this here clotted, formed a little clot and it stopped it. And when it stopped it, allowed them to recover. That’s what saved them. That’s what saved them. Because otherwise, it would have continued, would have died, both of them. Both of them would have died. This is a miracle.

Male: Yeah, grace of God.

Dr. Reiter: Yeah.

[end video]

SID: Did you get that? A medical doctor said, “This is a miracle.” And God is not a respecter of persons. As a matter of fact, God spoke to you audibly, and what did he tell you?

DON: The Lord spoke to me and said, “If you can convince the people I will do my work.” And so I took that to mean that if, in my preparation and in my preaching, I needed to take the Scriptures that the Lord had laid on my heart and figure out what can I do in my delivery, in my presentation to convince these people that God is actually going to do and wants to do this. And I think that when my preaching changed that the number of miracles began to increase that we were seeing in our church and our ministry. You know, Ephesians 3:20 says that, “God is able to do exceedingly and abundantly above that which we are able to ask or think of him according to the power of works in us.” Now the problem is, not that we think God is not able. Our problem is believing he’s willing. And the Bible says he’s able to do these things, and that exceedingly and abundantly means that God will go past or way past, do more than what the Bible says that we can ask or think of him.

SID: You’re convinced of that, aren’t you?

DON: I’m convinced of that, yes.

SID: Okay. There are crosses that people bear. All of a sudden, a doctor says you have cancer. All of a sudden, there’s an accident. Tell me about the Mr. Funderburg.

DON: John Funderburg is a pastor friend of mine. He pastors a church in Murfreesboro, Arkansas. And at 32 years old, John is a great big guy, he’s a healthy, strong guy, and at 32 years old, suddenly, he was overcome with a heart problem. In a 24-hour period of time, John went from working in a sawmill to being in an intensive care unit, in a hospital in Hot Springs, Arkansas. And that night, the doctors came and told him wife Crystal that there’s very little chance of his survival. His heart was pumping 10 to 15 percent of what it should be pumping. The only chance would be for a heart transplant.

SID: Simultaneously, what were you and your church doing while this is going?

DON: We’re praying. Everyone that knew John was praying. There were people all over the nation, maybe around the world that were praying for John.

SID: Did the doctor expect him to recover?

DON: The doctor did not expect him to recover.

SID: Well let me read you a report from the doctor that was involved in that. And the doctor’s name is Dr. Steven Hutchins, Medical Director, Baptist Heart Transplant Institute. “Mr. Funderburg came to Baptist Medical Center with severe heart failure and in shock. He was gravely ill and being evaluated for heart transplantation at the time of his admission. I saw him in my office one month later and his repeat echo showed absolutely normal. Mr. Funderburg has a miraculous, you don’t see that from doctors, “a miraculous recovery.” Well when we come back, what happens when a world-renowned surgeon is operating on a patient and the Holy Spirit says, “Do something that has never been done before.” You realize the patient will die if this isn’t God and you also realize you’ll lose your practice. What would you do? We’re going to find out when we come back.