Sid Roth

Sid: I’ll tell you something it difficult to export something you don’t have yourself. And the Messiah came to set the captives free. He came to open up the prison doors, He came… I was reading this morning in Romans the 14^th chapter the 17^th verse “For the Kingdom of God is not food and drink but it’s righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.” And very few born again Christians have broken through to freedom, they’ve broken through to maintenance and self-help programs, but there is a difference between maintenance and total freedom. I’m not talking about Christians that perhaps had a drinking problem, or a drug problem, or a smoking problem, I’m saying there are so many little foxes that God says “I want to get rid of because the new wine is being poured out.” He saved the best for last and He wants you free not to walk but to run in the next, in the greatest, and I believe the last move of God’s Spirit in history. “The Kingdom of God is not food and drink but righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.” You know whether you have the righteousness or not it’s based on the word of God, you know whether you have the peace or not. The Hebrew word, this is Greek of course in the New Testament; the Hebrew word for peace is Shalom and it means completeness in your spirit, soul and body. You know whether you have true Shalom, and you know whether you have joy and if there’s some sort of… I have Craig Hill on the telephone he’s founder of Family Foundations International. And we’re making available this week his book “Freedom from Compulsive Habits Bondage Broken” and his 3 audio cassette teaching series is all connected “Identifying Shame.” And Craig you were talking on yesterday’s broadcast about a man that was set free and then the symptoms came back and he didn’t know what to do about it would you continue that story.

Craig: Sure you know what I’ve found Sid so many times what I’d liken going on in so many peoples lives it’s like smoke, fire and fuel. People have external things going on in their lives such as anger or a temptation to this or that. You know 2 of the most common ones probably are anger and impure thoughts. Really those are just like smoke, this man had an intense temptation back to drugs that is just like smoke and that as we were talking yesterday self-help programs even Christian intense effort programs are really just dealing with the smoke, the obvious point is that where there’s smoke there’s a fire. So we really don’t want to just have a smoke management program trying to manage the smoke so that it doesn’t harm us or harm other people in such an intense way. What we really want to do is we want to find out the source of that smoke which is a fire. So what I found in people’s lives is that when we see smoke there’s always fire. The fire is some kind of wounding experience that happened in people’s lives in the past and in most cases it’s actually in childhood.

Sid: And it’s buried that’s the problem it’s not that someone says “I don’t want to deal with it they don’t even know it so if they don’t recognize that there are symptoms of something deeper they’ll never know about the deeper.

Craig: Right, exactly. And so when you see smoke that smoke isn’t just emanating from no where there’s always a fire. And so there’s a fire that’s there. The fire is some kind of a wounding experience that happened in the past and then they’re fuel to that fire. And the fuel is a deep seated emotional lie that the enemy sows in the hearts of people. And it comes through those wounding experiences that often times that happens in people’s families. And just you just said “People don’t even remember the experience many times but the emotional pain is still there.”

Sid: Well, a lot of people say “But wait a second under the New Covenant if you know who you are you don’t have to dig up all of these things you’re just free.” I’ve heard that preached as long as I’ve been a believer!

Craig: You know the real simple answer to that is “Then there shouldn’t be any smoke!” (Laughing) If there… if that’s true then there shouldn’t be any smoke and what we know is that Yeshua died for those things His blood was shed but we know just like in physical healing that blood has to be applied to the specific area of our life when we do apply that blood. And when we really do allow the Lord to remove that lie then indeed we are free; if the lie is still there it continues to torment deep on the inside.

Sid: Tell me a few of the smoke that you talk about you mentioned anger.

Craig: Anger…

Sid: Everyone knows about drugs and homosexuality and that’s a problem but what are some of the acceptable smokes that people don’t deal with?

Craig: Well you know anger would be one; another one that’s real common especially for men are “Impure thoughts.” Thought lust that they simply don’t want to be there the just don’t tell anybody. Those kind of thoughts torment them but they’re there. Other types of externals that are maybe more acceptable are things like overeating and gossiping, watching television for 6 hours at a time. Jumping on a telephone and just talking and talking and talking those are all mechanisms that our own flesh uses to comfort something deep on the inside.

Sid: Why would it be comfort to talk a lot?

Craig: For some people, and that afflicts women more than men, but it’s not exclusive to women there’s a need on the inside to just talk and talk and talk. And a feeling that “If I can talk about this enough somehow or another I’ll find a solution and it’ll make the pain go away.” So people will just talk and talk and there’s really no goal to it there’s no purpose it’s just a comfort mechanism that’s being used really by the flesh. And the bottom line what we find Sid is that people’s flesh rises up and does something or another to bring a false comfort whenever the soul is out of peace. You know it’s an interesting thing that Hebrews chapter 4 verse 10 it talks about the fact let me just read this scripture. Hebrews 4:10 says “For the one that entered into his rest (This is speaking of God’s rest) has himself also rested from his works as God did from His.” What it’s saying is that a person who’s soul, soul being mind, will and emotions not spirit but their soul. When their soul is not at rest, when you’re soul is not at peace it says that what’s going to happen is that you’re going to busy doing your own works. In other words another way to put that is, whenever something is tormented on the inside, whenever there’s pain on the inside, discouragement, disappointment and emotional lie has been stimulated deep on the inside then your flesh is going to be busy going to work bringing something to bring a comfort to that.

Sid: Now could it be that someone would be busy in religious things would bring them comfort rather than… I mean their motivation is to medicate themselves by doing religious things rather than motivation in doing the kingdom of God.

Craig: We hate to think so but unfortunately that is the case. I ran into numerous missionaries on the field that as the truth were known when you got down to the bottom line the reason they’re doing what they’re doing is because something on the inside feels worthless and their own flesh has risen up with using exactly that mechanism if I can just do enough for God, if I could just do enough in the Kingdom then I could be a valuable person.

Sid: What happened to that fellow that was in drugs and got miraculously set free and then was working in the church helping other drug addicts and then everything came back.

Craig: Yeah 12 years later intense temptation to drugs came back and what we discovered when we just asked the Lord “Where is that coming from, what’s that root again” again God showed him a horrific experience that he had in his own family as a 6 year old being homosexually raped by his brother with his other brother just standing by watching not helping him. The result of that was an intense deep emotional lie imparted on the inside “You’re worthless, you have no value you’re only here to be used and abused by other people.” The result of that his own flesh rose up and used drugs in teenage years to comfort pain of that. Every time he’d be disappointed, hurt, wounded, shamed, made to feel worthless by other people it would stimulate the intense pain on the inside and that deep deep emotional pain “Your worthless.” Well, as we prayed the Lord exposed that to him and when he remembered the experience there was an intense hatred that came up in his heart toward his brother. And we said “Lord what do you want to do with that?” And he had the most amazing experience where the Lord Jesus Himself lifted that hatred off of him and said “I died for that, that’s why I died you’re not to wear that, you’re not to carry that anymore.” And the Lord Himself ministered to that, removed that and then he asked the Lord a key question “Lord on that day when my brother did that to me the devil was able to impart to me the answer to a deep question ‘Who am I?’ And the devil’s answer was ‘You’re nobody, you’re nothing, your worthless.’” And he said “Lord today I want You to answer that question.” And you know Sid the Lord just ministered to him the most beautiful thing about who he was. He said “Son, whose who I see you to be, you’re a royal prince; I love you you’re my son, you weren’t created to be abused by other people you were created to be loved, to be valued and to bring life to other people.” And here’s the most amazing thing, after the Lord ministered that to him the temptation to drugs was instantly gone and it was maintenance free, it wasn’t something he had to struggle to try to not think about anymore it just literally was not there. And again the temptation to drugs was the smoke just an external, the fire was the intense experience that happened to him. The fuel was the deep seated lie “You’re worthless.” And I know that we’ll probably be out of time shortly but tomorrow I would like to talk more about what that fuel is in people’s hearts, how it gets there and what we actually practically do so that the Lord can remove that fuel deep in our hearts.

Sid: Well, that’s the key, what about someone that’s fearful of speaking in public could that be something, smoke as you call it?

Craig: Many times that’s smoke because we know that fear is not coming from God. “God did not give us a spirit of fear” the Bible said. So many times people struggle with all kinds of fears that are….

Sid: Ah, we’re out of time…

Sid: My guest by way of telephone at his office in Lynwood, Washington, the Head of the Centennial Group George Otis, Jr. Perhaps your familiar with his father his father started Middle East Television. He started TV and radio throughout the Middle East and radio throughout the world. George was raised in that environment and he had his own encounter with the Lord which in a very supernatural fashion. God has been directing him especially in the area of documenting where entire cities are impacted for the Lord. Not just a few churches on fire for the Lord, but entire cities… George I have to tell you most people, most believers feel that “That’s not going to happen until the millennium.” What would you say to them?

George: Well, the good news is that these examples that were documenting are places that they can visit. They just need to find a week of time or a few days time buy a plane ticket and they can actually go and walk the streets of these communities and see what community transformation looks like. It is a faith building experience more and more people are actually visiting some of the locations that we’ve highlighted. And the communities that we’ve highlighted on our videos represent only a fraction of the case studies that we’re presently aware of which are now somewhere in the vicinity of 170 to 180 different locations.

Sid: Okay you were listing yesterday reasons why here in the west we don’t experience what’s happening in other areas, and the one that I have to trigger of all of them is the one called lack of hunger. Why do we have a lack of hunger here in the west is it that we have too many toys?

George: Yes, that’s a big part of it Sid we… you know how sometimes people summarize the 10 Commandments down into the first two. We can summarize I think the obstacles the transformation down into 2 things external distractions and internal offenses. And if we can overcome those 2 problems then we will see in our midst the Lord working in the same measure that He’s working in many regions and nation’s cities today.

Sid: So what’s your scenario how is this going to be overcome; to have us become a 3^rd world country that will sure do it.

George: That sometimes is what God will do and we need to see this sometimes as the grace and mercy of God. C.S. Lewis put it this way once he said “God’s love marshals me where I would go if I truly knew what I wanted.” So often we only think we know what we want it really isn’t what we want. And if God graciously sometimes highjacks the direction of our lives and our ministries and says “Listen, trust me I know where you would go if you truly knew what you wanted and I’m going to take you there.” And I think that what is happening today, in this country, that we are… we’re we’ve seen religious inertia become more valuable to us than genuine spiritual change. In other words if we’re active, if we’re just busy if things are happening all around us and there’s a lot of sound and energy and bodies we slip into this deception that were actually making progress. I’ll tell you how I would put it, I think that we are suffering from a form of deism. We in the west are more products of the enlightenment than we are in the book of Acts. We think that God got things all started He wound it all up and then He’s kind of left the scene for us to go ahead and figure out all of the fine print and details on our own. See you’ve got 100’s and 100’s of men and woman of western church today that are running like chickens with their head cut off trying to figure out what ought to be done rather than realizing God has an intense interest in the details and is about the details. So I think this issue of hunger requires us to get alone with God saying “God would you increase my appetite for those things that are proven to attract Your presence.”

Sid: Because you can’t work it up yourself… you know the hunger even comes from God.

George: That’s right it does and when we do that maybe it’s a hunger for unity or for holiness or for humility or for faith or for prayer or whatever it might be. It’s not that we have no appetite it’s that we have a bird like appetite. It’s like going into a restaurant after we had fellowship with the saints and we sit down to a meal and the waiter or waitress comes over and says “What can I bring you?” And we haven’t even cracked the menu so we send them away and then the 3^rd time they come back we’re embarrassed because we still don’t know and we just say off handedly “You know just bring me a cup of coffee.” That’s the response in the western church to the Holy Spirit who wants to bring us so much more we settle on a cup of coffee and a spiritual caffeine buzz; it’s just not going to take us where we need to go and where we truly would go if we knew what God could do for us.

Sid: Well, for example whet their appetite if you will so that people would at least pray “God give me the desire for unity, give me the desire to pray with my brothers and sisters so I can see the same thing.” Tell me about one of the cities on your transformation video Cali, Columbia. When I think of Columbia I think of drugs.

George: Well, most people do and that the extent of the reputation that was generated several years ago in the city of Cali which became the epicenter of the global cocaine cartel. There were over 100,000 people in this city that were on the direct, not the indirect, payroll of the cocaine cartels. This was a multibillion dollar enterprise. And I’ve seen their compounds down there and unless you’ve seen it you just can’t believe it. They were small cities within the city within their own air strips helipads their own shopping malls, their own restaurants. These drug lords would go to a restaurant in a city find a place they liked and would hire the cook and bring him into their compounds to start these private little restaurants. They would have underground tunnels connecting up to 25 massive mansions. And that would be only one compound and there were multiple ones within the city. They owned the police, they owned the banks, they owned the sport franchises, they ran everything. And so you can imagine what life in this city would have been like and to make matters worse the Body of Christ was so disunified, disunited, that one person told me Ministerial Association in the city of Cali several years ago consisted of one box of files that nobody wanted. (Laughing) That’s where they were at. And so in the midst of all 15 people a day were being murdered it was a mess. A few believers got so desperate they cried out to God and they said “You know we have to move the church together to call out to God to repent because that’s our only hope.” So they called an event in the municipal stadium there and to their surprise nearly 25,000 people showed up for an all night prayer vigil and they asked…

Sid: But you know what? They were desperate.

George: They were.

Sid: And that’s what we were just talking, here in the west we’re not desperate!

George: That’s exactly right we… we’re under the mistaken assumption that like the church at Sardis, and like the church at Laodicea, that we are in real good shape. And you’ll remember that what the Lord said to the Church at Sardis “You have a reputation of being alive but in fact you are dead.” And then He goes on to say “Now strengthen that which remains.” And what He’s saying there is “Return first love, move away from program and back to presence.” Because only God is capable of doing the heavy lifting that is required to see the community transformed. I believe that human programming and human charisma are adequate to see church growth, but they’re inadequate to see community transformation. Only God can do the heavy lifting as I said to bring that about. In the city of Cali, Columbia when they gathered together to cry out to God they began to initially talk to God about the violence problems. And that very weekend there headlines blazoned “No homicides” for the first time and as long as anybody could remember…

Sid: Are you saying the weekend these 25,000 Christians gathered for prayer there were no homicides?

George: It was that very same weekend that they talked to God about that issue. The city newspaper “El Pais,” and this is a community of about 3 million people headlined “No Homicide.” There had never been in anybody’s memory a weekend where nobody had been murdered in this city…

Sid: Oh, they figured something out real fast. George we’re out of time today.

Sid: We want everyone everywhere to be red hot for the Messiah, why? Well there’s so many people that talk about friendship evangelism and let’s wait until someone asks me about the Messiah. Well, let me tell you something my guest right now Hal Lindsey if he with his knowledge of end-time events and things happening so quickly that he does a world-wide television show that is on a 24 hour delay and he said “Sid it’s a too big a delay things are happening too rapidly.” Now on yesterday’s broadcast I’ll get a lot of people upset with me Hal if I don’t ask you the question. I wanted to know what you think of what is considered by the words of President Bush our good friend the nation Saudi Arabia.

Hal: I think that Saudi Arabia is probably one of the most dangerous of all of the nations in Islam. And the reason is because they have some of the most dedicated clerics to promote a radical form of Islamic fundamentalism. And it’s called Wahabism and you just look 15 of the 19 terrorist who struck the United States in the September 11, 2001 were Saudis. And you look at Al-Qaida; Al-Qaida the leadership is mostly composed of Saudis so they’re very very dangerous.

Sid: Now, in your video you happened to comment on what recently happened with President Bush when Prince Abdullah of Saudi Arabia visited him and he had some company; tell me about that.

Hal: Well, he had some Emmas with him that remained on the plane who had called for destruction of the United States. They were on the same plane with the Saudi Prince and one of them remained on the plane because is he’d have gotten off he would have gotten arrested. But these were some of the clerics of Islam from Saudi Arabia who have been the most prolific in their condemnation of the United States.

Sid: I’ve got a quote here by one of the men on the plane. “I am against America until this life ends until the Day of Judgment; I am against America even if the stones liquefy. My hatred of America if part of it was just contained in the universe the whole universe would collapse. America is the root of all evils, our good friends Saudi Arabia on the same plane they came in?

Hal: Yes, that is absolutely amazing but that is true. And this is why you know I love our President I believe he’s truly a believer but he is perhaps fatally flawed in his understanding of Islam. He stills keeps saying that Islam is a religion of peace; it is not! You know people say “Well, you know there are radicals that come out of Christianity just as there are radicals that come out of Islam.” This true but here’s the difference the more a person follows literally what the Bible says and the more he follows Jesus Christ the more he will be peaceful. But the more a person follows the Koran and follows the example of Mohammed the more he will become a terrorist.

Sid: You know Hal I’m concerned about the Trojan horse in America of these people that are involved in Islam. I heard recently that their latest strategy is to go to major American universities, offer them tremendous sums of money to build buildings on their campuses to make them schools of Islam. They then hire the whole faculty. And I’m told in many of the mosques in America that preaching this virulent brand of terrorism. Are you aware of these things that are going on right under our nose?

Hal: Oh, absolutely I follow them closely and they’re of great concern to me. You see the Saudi’s with a very very great assortment of money and they seek to buy their way in. And I believe that we just have to recognize that their goal is to convert the United States to Islam.

Sid: Are they succeeding in the United States, I know that their succeeding in the prisons.

Hal: Well, I have a cousin who is a chaplain in the prisons in Texas and Oklahoma and he said the greatest threat he sees is that they’re converting to Islam all kinds of prisoners that this almost a plague that their converting so many prisoners to Islam. And you know they bring with them the ferocity of their criminal life and it’s conducted into a sanctified form of hatred for America.

Sid: Okay, I understand how they’ve been successful in the prisons but how come what is the attraction of Islam to nations like Africa, places like Southeast Asia, Philippines, what is the attraction there of Islam?

Hal: Well, it has an enormous attraction particularly in Southeast Asia you know there’s a kind of a religious vacuum there and mankind has to have some kind of religion. They’re religious my nature and so it has had a tremendous appeal particularly Southeast Asia. For instance Indonesia is the most populous country of Islam in the world. And also it is the new foundation for Islam.

Sid: Well, tell me about…you state the Oklahoma bombings have direct ties to the Philippians, I haven’t heard that in the news!

Hal: This is something that I think is really being covered over deliberately because the perpetrators of that bombing in Oklahoma married a Philippine girl, he went back to the Philippians spent some time there with some of her relatives who are members of the radical violent Islamic group that are in the Philippines. So it’s believed that there’s a connection I know that World Net Daily has a book that they’re featuring that connects the dots on that.

Sid: Hm. Now you go into a lot of detail in your video “Evidence of the End Time” having to do with Africa. I mean I don’t understand why our news and our media are not making a big deal out of all of the non-Muslims that are being killed especially Christians by Muslims in Africa.

Hal: Yeah, this is something that is a travesty I mean you know we report all kinds of human injustices around the world but when it comes to the slaughter and the massacre of Christians by Muslims in the Africa it’s virtually glossed over. And I’ve heard one of the reasons is because it’s so dangerous correspondence don’t go there. But whatever the cause the spread of Islam in Africa is rampant.

Sid: I mean how large is Islam in Africa?

Hal: Well, and this is what is really amazing we talk about whose really responsible for sending slaves to the Americas and so forth. Well, it was the Muslims who would go in and conquer the African tribes and send them on these slave ships

Sid: I wasn’t aware of that.

Hal: Oh yeah it was Muslims that did that they were the worst slavers in history. And yet now these very ones that they used to prey about are being converted to Islam. And it’s a very decisive force in Africa. It’s one of the only really transnational organizing movements in all of Africa but its moving fast. And Ezekiel very definitely talks about the fact the descendants of Cush and Put would be a very big part of the force that launches the War of Armageddon.

Sid: And push and put…

Hal: But the black African’s and Put is the father of the North African people such as Libya, Algeria, Tunisia, Morocco and Mauritania; those are all descendants of this tribe called Put.   So and it’s interesting that all of those are Muslim countries.

Sid: How about Russia? I mean we know in the Bible in the last days how does Russia network with Islam?

Hal: Well, Ezekiel chapter 38 and also Daniel Chapter 11 verse 40 – 45 indicates that it would be this great power to the north. In fact Ezekiel says that they are the people that are to the extreme north of Israel in the last days. Well there’s only one nation to the extreme north of Israel and that’s Russia. It says that they’re going to make a strategic mistake, God will cause them to do it and they will align themselves with these Muslim confederacy, all of the nations around Israel which are Muslim. And they will supply them with weapons and they will lead them in the last great attack against Israel. And it will be because of the enormous wealth and prestige of Israel that they attack. So this is why I say something dramatic has to happen to Israel soon to give them enormous wealth.

Sid: Okay what about a Palestinian State based on your study of scripture, what your intuitive sense, will there be a Palestinian State before it’s over?

Hal: I guess there could be but I am so against it that it’s hard for me to accept. I don’t know if there will be one but it is possible. But I do know this that a big point is made in Ezekiel 38 about the people of Israel making a covenant with this Roman leader the anti-Christ. And they will be able to live without walls and you know this is talking about conditions in the last days.

Sid: Well, of course they’re putting in the big wall right now.

Hal: Yeah, cities are no longer walled but they’re talking about putting a wall….

Sid: Oh, we’re out of time…

Sid: My guest by way of telephone is Dr. James Richards I’m interviewing him on his book “How to Stop the Pain.” Pain maybe in evitable but suffering optional, but what’s even more exciting to me is there are walls between husbands and wives, children and parents, wives and husbands, pastors and members of the congregations, employers and employees, schoolmates everything these walls… and God is supernaturally showing us how these walls can come down and we don’t have to keep that pain Yeshua took the pain for us. But one of the most fascinating things Jim in your book has to do with the correlation between sickness and judgment. On yesterday’s broadcast you were saying that physiologically when we make judgments we open ourselves it’s almost like a door is open for sickness explain this.

Jim: Exactly that’s right and incredibly the mind always seeks equilibrium. In other words, the moment you pass a judgment everything in your mind and in your brain actually goes to work to prove that it’s true. There’s a little bundle of nerves…

Sid: Give me an example of a judgment and then explain what you’re explaining.

Jim: Okay the judgment is assuming to know why someone is doing something. Of course the brain actually does this on any assumption it doesn’t have to be a judgment. I’ll give you a good example let’s say you look down the street here and you a lady and she kind of dressed maybe what you might consider a little like a temptress or something.

Sid: And you see, hay not down the street you see them in church.

Jim: Yeah.

Sid: And you form that judgment, that everyone can relate there.

Jim: You say “This is why she is this way she’s loose she’s immoral.” And you watch her as she walks down the street and you notice that she’s walking up to men and talking to them. So you’re absolutely sure then that she’s a prostitute and that she’s trying to sell herself to these men. And everything that you begin to see there’s a little bundle of nerves called the reticular activating system at the base of the skull…

Sid: And you know the devil doesn’t even have to function in this you’re doing just fine you’re doing his job. (Laughing)

Jim: You’re doing his job and he’s taking a little break and laughing at you. Well the moment that you pass a judgment or make an assumption the reticular activating system starts changing the function of the brain and you go into selective processing and you begin to only see and notice those things that support your judgment or your opinion. So now you’re seeing all of this stuff that tells you this woman’s a prostitute. Now when she gets up to you she walks up to you you’re ready for her to proposition you she hands you a track and you find out that she’s a Christian and she was witnessing to those people and you didn’t even notice that she was carrying a Bible, and you didn’t even notice any of these other factors all you noticed would be those things that would support your judgment.

Sid: Selective editing.

Jim: And we do that I don’t know if you’ve ever done it you go to the grocery store and you’re wife says go pick up this stuff and make sure you get this brand and make sure that it doesn’t have any salt in it. You run in the grocery store you look at the label you pick it up you run back home; you open the bag and you proudly hand it to your wife and she’s like “What did you get this for?” And you look at it and its like “That’s not what I bought.” But you and I both know that you can look at something and believe that you’re reading a different label.

Sid: So we humans because of Adams original sin, our disposition is to judge and when we judge what happens now physiologically?

Jim: When we judge… here’s the incredible thing here’s the place that judgment and sickness comes together is basically the judgments we pass about ourselves and even the judgments that we pass about God. If I’m… see guilt brings the expectation of punishment. And so when I commit when I commit a particular sin when I struggle with something and I pass a judgment on God you know and maybe things begin to go wrong in my life I say “This is why this is happening God is doing this to me.” You know we run a substance abuse clinic for years and we found that you can’t get people off drugs and you can’t get people well if they believe God’s doing it to them or they believe that it’s punishment for something they’ve done.

Sid: Hm.

Jim: Now what happens every cell in the body actually has intelligence. With the advent of our understanding of DNA this has become common knowledge in the scientific community. And you figure that there’s enough intelligence in a cell to clone a human being possibly, we know that they can clone an animal so there’s a lot of intelligence there. Well that intelligence in every cell is not just intellectual intelligence it’s also emotional intelligence. So anything that you believe at a very deep level every cell in your body believes it and works to make it happen. So if I’m in expectation of punishment coming to me from something that I have done the fact that I’m expecting that, the fact that I have…

Sid: Isn’t that what Job was saying when he said “The thing that I feared…”

Jim: Sure.

Sid: “…has come upon me?”

Jim: Exactly, that’s what the children of Israel did. They said the tested or tempted God they put God on trial they passed the judgment that says “He could not be trusted.” And that’s why they fell in the wilderness. So the person that believes something every cell in their body works and if you believe for example that you’re unworthy of success then every time you have the opportunity to succeed you’re going to have a conflict with your boss and something’s going to go wrong. And you can scream at the devil you can pray more but the truth is until you release your judgments and renew your mind it’s going to keep going that way.

Sid: Someone that’s accident prone that might be the reason.

Jim: Exactly. Interesting thing, I don’t know if we have enough time to go into this, but I had a problem that where every time I had an off day I got sick. I either got sick, felt bad or injured myself. And so this went on for years and finally after several years in my lightning quick mind I said “There’s a problem, there’s something wrong here.”

Sid: (Laughing)

Jim: I spent some time in prayer and meditation just seeking God and the Lord brought to my memory a time when I was a child and my father had come home and beat my mother all night. And the next morning she was getting ready to go to work I was extremely emotional I was crying and I was pleading with her “Please do not go to work.” And she said “Son as long as I’m able I have to work.” Now I developed a belief from that that said “The only reason not to work is to not be able.” Out of that belief every time I’d get an off day I’d get sick or injure myself and when I realized that all of this was emerging out of my own heart it was as simple as releasing that belief choosing a new belief and moving on and bringing an end to it and it doesn’t happen anymore.

Sid: Do you think that all sicknesses is a result of what you just described?

Jim: No, I don’t think that all sicknesses are we have physiologically things that happen to us. I have found that the ability to recover from sickness is directly related to our beliefs and particularly our beliefs about worthiness.

Sid: Give me another specific example.

Jim: A specific example?

Sid: Yes.

Jim: I have had dozens of people in my clinic that this has happened to. A person comes in… I’ll give you one on weight loss this is

Sid: Oh, I want that one.

Jim: There’s somebody that comes in their… and this actually happened a lady she was probably 300 pounds overweight she had tried everything in the whole world nothing ever worked. I began to work with her and she had lost about 80 or 100 pounds. Suddenly she just loses her mind, metaphorically, goes crazy goes on an eating binge disappears won’t come back into the clinic. Now ultimately what I was eventually able to discover in working with her was that she had a belief that if she was thin that she would get into sin because she had a promiscuous past. And she had passed this judgment about herself and about why I do this and why you know why it would happen to me if I looked thin again. And so even though she was getting the desired results she sabotaged it. Actually studies show that most people’s fatal illness occur at their moments of great opportunity.

Sid: Explain that.

Jim: Really most people don’t believe that they deserve to retire they’ve worked all of their life they don’t feel qualified, they don’t feel it’s right that they have something. Like in my example I grew up believing that I was unlovable. So when I would get in a relationship the moment the relationship would begin to become good I would destroy it and run. See the same thing happened with sickness, it happens with finances if we live out our beliefs and judgments and literally can’t see life any other way.

Sid: Jim how did you come to all of this understanding? This is brilliant it really is.

Jim: Well again you know fortunately for me I wasn’t raised in church so I didn’t have a lot of preconceived ideas. And when I read the Bible I didn’t read it so much from a mystical point of view I read it from a very practical point of view. And really all of this came out of number 1 the pages of the Bible, and then me applying this to my personal life. Then taking it into the lives of the people that I have ministered to for these 30 years.

Sid: Quick give me a testimony of somebody that’s read your book and what’s happened to them.

Jim: This doesn’t have anything to do with healing but one particular testimony pops in mind was a man who calls me and he said “You know something my wife and I have been reading your material.” And he said “We’ve been married we’ve come from a strict background not a lot of love and compassion shown in his background.” He said “You know for the first time in 21 years out of her own initiative she put her arms around me and told me she loved me.”